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  #11  
Old 05-03-2018
Rajan Rajan is offline
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What I have understood from the Post of Inge and CoachBobM that Catch Initiates rolling but until that time I will have to be in skate position from the start of recovery to hand touches the water (Mail Slot)and there is no rolling during this time. Is it right now?

Regards

Rajan


Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachBobM View Post
I agree with Inge. The main function of the rotation of your core body about the axis of your spine is to help power your armstroke, so you should initiate it in conjunction with the beginning of your catch.

What is true is that there should be no time when some part of your body is not moving. While you want a patient leading arm, your other arm should begin its recovery as soon as it reaches your hip.


Bob
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  #12  
Old 05-03-2018
Mushroomfloat
 
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I start rolling towards the recovering arm when passes shoulder height

If you do fingertip drag drill you will see the point at which you start rolling towards the recovering arm as long as you keep fingertips touching the water (or keep your wrists in the water)
Its a rise & fall motion.
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  #13  
Old 05-03-2018
Mushroomfloat
 
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If you stay up all the way to entry your weight shift will be slamming in
better to let the recovering arm enter and the rest of the body follow through the hole
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  #14  
Old 05-03-2018
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CoachStuartMcDougal CoachStuartMcDougal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajan View Post
... I had practiced to remain in the skate position after start of recovery until hand dips in water. During this period (ie. from start of recovery to reaching at mail slot and hand dips) I do not role and it gives me feeling that I am not moving forward and my head and neck also get tensed.
Hard to tell without a video, but given your description of feeling tension in neck and deceleration at mail-slot entry is most likely the recovery arm is too close to the body causing tight shoulder and neck. The deceleration is slowing or stalling the arm/hand at entry stunting the momentum of recovery arm. Swing arm away from the body, send its weight and momentum forward. Done correctly, recovery arm will enter correctly without having to slow arm to aim at the mail-slot.

The weight and momentum of the recovery arm rotates the body or initiates rotation, connected to hip rotation and downward kick. This is also referred to as the "weight shift" with whole body coordination - accessing external forces of gravity and momentum for rotation and propulsion.

Stu
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  #15  
Old 05-03-2018
thaddeus.ward@gmail.com
 
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Not sure if I am doing it right, but my body is quiet in the glide. (I love the glide.) I initiate the rotation with my spear. I am not aware enough of my body to know the exact timing, but I think it is the moment my hand hits the water. (something to pay attention to in my next swim)

It also sounds right that the tension/pain comes from keeping the hands/shoulders too tight in. Try the drills (blanking on the name) where you dip the hand in your field of vision without completing the stroke. I found the focus on keeping my arm loose and the timing of the switch, (body roll) really helpful.
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  #16  
Old 05-04-2018
Mushroomfloat
 
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Apparently your hands should never leave your field of vision,
I.e remain in your peripheral vision.
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  #17  
Old 05-04-2018
Mushroomfloat
 
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your arm articulates around the elbow, circling inside on the pull / circling outside on the recovery.
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  #18  
Old 05-04-2018
CoachDavidShen CoachDavidShen is offline
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I typically advocate getting really good at holding the body angle in Skate so as to *not* be rolling when you finish the stroke at the hip and you are recovering.

If you are begin to roll back down as you recover:

1. you will be losing the full potential of using the body rotation to drive the arm forward because you'll be partially rotated already.

2. It could also cause you to try to pull the elbow behind you to keep the arm high because you're starting to rotate that arm into the water.

3. drag increases with extraneous motion so keep calm, quiet, and balanced on your Skate edge of body as you bring your recovering arm forward. If you are already rotating, you're increasing your drag and decelerating as you're bring your recovering arm forward.

Your goal instead is to minimize deceleration during the phases where there is no propulsion, like between the finish of the stroke back and recovery to entry forward. So get good at Skate so that when you swim full stroke, you can remain perfectly balanced on your Skate edge during recovery.
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  #19  
Old 05-04-2018
Rajan Rajan is offline
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During this phase I feel deceleration as you mentioned from recovery to entry forward. Can this deceleration be eliminated by being in Skate position ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachDavidShen View Post
Your goal instead is to minimize deceleration during the phases where there is no propulsion, like between the finish of the stroke back and recovery to entry forward. So get good at Skate so that when you swim full stroke, you can remain perfectly balanced on your Skate edge during recovery.
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  #20  
Old 05-04-2018
John@NewPaltz
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachStuartMcDougal View Post
The weight and momentum of the recovery arm rotates the body or initiates rotation, connected to hip rotation and downward kick. This is also referred to as the "weight shift" with whole body coordination - accessing external forces of gravity and momentum for rotation and propulsion.

Stu
This is in my opinion a very important part of it. A relaxed shoulder of the recovering arm will automatically bring the recovering arm into a position (above water) that will create a rotational momentum. Yes, the skate position on the side is the most streamlined position. But forcefully holding it through the entire recovery bears the risk that you start compensating this rotational momentum with your feet or spearing arm or both. And this compensational effort will reduce drag more than a slightly earlier start of rotation.
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