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  #1  
Old 06-08-2012
katypfarmgirl katypfarmgirl is offline
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katypfarmgirl
Default High Elbow Catch

I am confused...once the hand is extended, leaving the patient lead hand, then there is a theory (if i understand this) the hand and elbow drop below the elbow which stays in place/high so there is a 90 degree angle at the elbow. And then the push to the hip.

So in TI the "anchor is where the hand floats comfortably down to in the water which seems much deeper under the surface than conventional swimmers. Does that precluded getting a " high elbow catch".

Mike Phelps video really exemplifies the high elbow catch.

How important is this for the TI technique??
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  #2  
Old 06-08-2012
tomoy tomoy is offline
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I think the TI deep spear is intended as a learning point for new swimmers who first need to get balanced properly, horizontally in the water. It's the early part of the progression and will improve a beginner's stroke the most. Best bang for the buck.

Later, the spear can be less deep because of balance (head position, front quadrant swimming...). A less-deep spear also reduces drag. Then much later, the high-elbow catch becomes a goal.

With TI, streamlining always comes before propulsion.
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  #3  
Old 06-08-2012
daveblt daveblt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katypfarmgirl View Post
I am confused...once the hand is extended, leaving the patient lead hand, then there is a theory (if i understand this) the hand and elbow drop below the elbow which stays in place/high so there is a 90 degree angle at the elbow. And then the push to the hip.



So in TI the "anchor is where the hand floats comfortably down to in the water which seems much deeper under the surface than conventional swimmers. Does that precluded getting a " high elbow catch".

Mike Phelps video really exemplifies the high elbow catch.
How important is this for the TI technique??
I think you meant hand and elbow below the shoulder ? The arm must float out to full extension with hand below elbow and elbow below shoulder . The elbow will reach it's maximum height as your hand passes under your body .This technique not only helps with balance but also in setting up your catch so that your hand is already in position with the palm facing back as you anchor your hand for the pull.

Dave
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  #4  
Old 06-10-2012
CoachSuzanne CoachSuzanne is offline
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They are not mutually exclusive. TI teaches a much kinder, gentler version of the "not-quite-as-early-almost-vertical-forarm" in the form of the soft hook or beginning the stroke in the shape of a VW beetle hood.

The EVF/HEC that you see in the videos of the olympians simply are not achievable by the majority of people due to flexibility issues. We get as close as we can while keeping the shoulder joint healthy instead.

Swim instructors that don't understand flexibility limitations of most adult swimmers/triathletes, and that don't understand well the biomechanics of trying to achieve an EVF with a flat body (what you see on the tele) vs. the soft hook formed in unison with the body rotating are apt to both frustrate and injure their swimmers.

See this for an example of a good way to teach it for adult swimmers ... this drill is called the "Skatch" (Skate -> Catch)
http://steelcityendurance.smugmug.co...4695&k=kj2qxcT
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Suzanne Atkinson, MD
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USA Paralympic Triathlon Coach
Coach of 5 time USA Triathlon Triathlete of the Year, Kirsten Sass
Steel City Endurance, LTD
Fresh Freestyle

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  #5  
Old 06-10-2012
bpusnsailor bpusnsailor is offline
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Thanks to all...Suzanne your clip was great. I had actually made up that drill this past week and used a Finis Snorkel to really stay with it for the full 50. Your clip is not far off to my untrained eye from slow mo views of the superstars. The HEC here is pretty spot on. Just wanted a perspective from a TI coach. Alaways much room for inprovement in the stroke. Funny in recreational circles how poorly swimming is understood. To paraphrase Terry "there is nothing natural about the stroke".
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  #6  
Old 06-10-2012
rcrawf rcrawf is offline
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Thanks Suzanne, great work, my shoulders and I thank you!

Rich
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