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  #1  
Old 04-03-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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Default Triathlon 1.4.10

Olympic triathlon should be

2.5k swim, 10k run finished with 25K bike. this would put all three disciplines in equal importance and also spread the field out on the bike to avoid slip streaming.

How did the distances get skewed in the first place.
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Old 04-03-2012
rbs24h rbs24h is offline
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Hey Andy, by skewed I am assuming you mean that the events are not equal in time raced. I guess that is because of the origin of the long distance triathlon race. Swimmers in Hawaii used to debate with the runners and cyclists who were the fittest. So they combined a Waikiki Rough Water Swim (2.4) miles, the 115Mi Oahu bike race and the Honolulu Marathon for an event to be done all in ONE DAY with the winner of the 15 original entrants to be called "The Ironman". So the races evolved from the original seemed to use approximately the same Swim to Bike to Run ratio. I think the Olympic (also International Distance) distances were arrived at using the metric system instead of the "miles" used for the original races but with about the same ratios. They did shorten the bike some to make it a little less "skewed". As far as the slipstreaming goes, it is illegal in USTA sanctioned races with time penalties and having the bike at the end of the race is a much easier event to finish. One of the toughest parts of a triathlon is the transition from bike to run because of your heavy legs, not to mention having to run/walk to the finish AFTER having completed the other two disciplines. And one of the staple workouts in traditional training for a triathlon is your "Brick" workout, when you practice running immediately off the bike. Painful stuff.

Hope that helps, not sure if you have ever participated in triathlon, but if not, give it a try, it is a blast. And truly a place to practice TI.

Cheers,
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Old 04-03-2012
rbs24h rbs24h is offline
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Oh, the point was that they combined races that already existed. So the 2.4 mile swim was already the distance of the Waikiki Rough Water Swim, same for bike race and marathon. They were individual events that were used as the template for the distances that created this new race called "Triathlon". Though a shorter version was done in San Diego first, it didn't catch on like the "Ironman" version from Hawaii.
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Old 04-04-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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Really interesting to know that. So the breakdown of discipline splits has come about from coincidence rather than planning.

I smell opportunity for change so that each section of the event becomes worth competing in. My understanding is that the great runners win more often than the cyclists or swimmers?

I did some triathlon in the early 1990's straight after school but not since. I think some olympic distance and sprint events will find themselves back in my diary soon as my uk friends are all keen.
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Old 04-04-2012
Richardsk Richardsk is offline
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Hi Andy

I am planning to swim in a triathlon as one of a team this summer. The local club is running their inaugural tri and I am to do the swim with a friend's daughter doing the bike and one of his friends doing the run. It should be fun and I am debating whether to buy a wetsuit or try swimming 'naked'.

We have had a strange and unusual warm spell here and people have been jumping in to the sea but I gather it is still very cold. It looks very tempting, though.

Perhaps you could look into the possibility of team swimming.
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Old 04-04-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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Yes its fun in a team, we did a tri in reading I think it was 1992 and that was a team event.

Just spent the week skiing with old school friends, one of them swam 10K around bermuda sound last year in 2:49 which I thought was amazing, he didn't as his wife did under 2:30

Swimming success is so relative.

Still going to persue my 1.4.10 triathlon ratios. I wonder how many athletes could go under 1:30 for 2.5/10/25??
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Old 04-04-2012
rbs24h rbs24h is offline
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Interesting Andy. I would think 90 minutes for 2.5/10/25 would be very possible for elites but as always in triathlon, it would depend on the course.

But using Middle to Front of Pack results from Beijing, times would be approx:

30 min for swim at 1:12/100m,
32 minutes for run at 5:09/mi pace,
22:20 minutes for bike at 40KPH.

But I believe the times would be even faster if raced in this order (SRB, I know mine was)
But even these split times would get them in well under the 90 minutes even adding T1 and T2. So for elites, yes, but probably not many Age Groupers would be finishing in less than 1 1/2 hours.

Good luck with it.
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Old 04-04-2012
CoachToby CoachToby is offline
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Andy. A very good point you raise. I've always thought the ratios in triathlon are completely skewed, especially in the longer events. Interesting points from rbs24h on the origins of the sport, but I suspect the runners and cyclists had more clout when it came to deciding the ratios. I strongly believe this imbalance should be corrected. How about a TI triathlon with some sensible race distances?

On a related matter, wetsuits that are not neutrally buoyant should be banned! Cheats!! The most important thing in any sport is providing a level playing field for competitors. This is certainly not happening in triathlon!

Ps. Swimming is my weakest event.
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  #9  
Old 04-05-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbs24h View Post
Interesting Andy. I would think 90 minutes for 2.5/10/25 would be very possible for elites but as always in triathlon, it would depend on the course.

But using Middle to Front of Pack results from Beijing, times would be approx:

30 min for swim at 1:12/100m,
32 minutes for run at 5:09/mi pace,
22:20 minutes for bike at 40KPH.

But I believe the times would be even faster if raced in this order (SRB, I know mine was)
But even these split times would get them in well under the 90 minutes even adding T1 and T2. So for elites, yes, but probably not many Age Groupers would be finishing in less than 1 1/2 hours.

Good luck with it.
A 25K bike in 30minutes would need average of 50KPH not 40 which is why I think 90 minutes including transition would be pretty elite? Might get some of the tri boys in town to agree to a test in the summer with 8 entrants or so.

Might also vent the idea on some tri forums. ha ha

think I would be over 2.30 if I had to do one tomorrow but then I do not cycle or run so often.
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Old 04-06-2012
rbs24h rbs24h is offline
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LOL, somehow calculated 15k instead of 25k. oops...The Ironman elites can average 25MPH for 112 mi so I would think, if the course isn't too hilly, that such a short bike could be really fast, especially with no run to "save" for. Basically an all out sprint. 50k/hr? Probably not.

But the swim is the most daunting for most people. And being able to swim the distance is only half the battle. The panic of an open water swim, with 100 others in your wave clawing, grabbing, pushing and kicking the stuffing out of you can make it more about survival than swimming, at the start. I read that Ironman Wisconsin, with 2800 entrants, was so crowded that the entire 2.4 mi swim was just kind of "side-stroking" the whole way. But the panic I mentioned was only for my first open water race. Once you get through one, you learn.

Also, Aquathon (swim/run) events seem to satisfy the swimmers that want to "Multi-Sport" in Southern California, anyway.

All that said, there probably is a group that would like to see the events more evenly split. I say you pick a cause that interests you and organize the first 1-4-10 Triathlon. I can see the 1.4.10 t-shirts, stickers and tatoos already!!
I would imagine times will be fast and there would be much fewer DNF's with the different order. Keep us updated.
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