Total Immersion Forums  

Go Back   Total Immersion Forums > Freestyle
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-20-2011
yann yann is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Lausanne, Switzerland
Posts: 49
yann
Default What is you favourite tempo trainer range of speed ?

Hi all,

Today I've reached the longest distance I ever swim without interruption: 200m ! Ok that's not much, but I'm trying to improve in ladder keeping my SPL in my "optimum" range (35-42 per 50m).

Now my question, which Tempo Trainer speed or range of speed do you use for your training. For me it's pretty slow: 1.4-2.0, with a preference at about 1.5

What about yours ? Is my TT speed something I should find very slow, slow or average?

Thanks !
Yann
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-20-2011
rustybc rustybc is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2
rustybc
Default

Hi Yann,

I think you're doing the right thing - experiment with different tempo's to find the one that works best on a given day.

I usually start a session at one tempo, then go faster or slower until I find my most fluid motion for the day. I will forcefully vary it for different purposes, but for just to get in the pool and do some happy laps, I'll dial-in my tempo in 3-4 laps of experimentation.

Most days I start at 1.10 and find my most comfortable pace between 1.05 and 1.2.

Is your current main goal to increase your distance? If so, then finding a tempo that allows you to keep your form and yields effortless swimming for YOU is the best tempo!

Best,
Rusty
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-20-2011
yann yann is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Lausanne, Switzerland
Posts: 49
yann
Default

Hi Rusty,

Actually my current goal is to increase my distance. I used to stop at every 25m lap, not because I was out of breath, but because I wanted to keep my SPL in the low range of my optimum range (15-17 for my height). For this quarter my goal is to reach 300m. It might look modest, but it is quite challenging for me as it is 12 times my usual length. Additionnally I'm now swimming in a 50m pool.

By end of June, I'll decide if I'll try to further increase the length or if I'll try to increase the tempo. Not decided yet.

Thanks for your feedback on your TT range. May I ask you for how long you're swimming?

Yann
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-21-2011
terry terry is offline
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,305
terry has disabled reputation
Default An Organized Way to Find your Weak Point

Yann
I have a few practice suggestions both for increasing distance and for finding your optimal Tempo Trainer range. Both are based on a critical principle of Mastery: To improve at anything, you need to find your weak point. Swimming with SPL and Tempo makes it very easy and accurate.

To Find Optimal TT Range
Do 2 or 3 series of 50m repeats (I gather your pool is 50m - if so, you're most fortunate) in a pattern like this:
1.3
1.4
1.5
1.45
1.4
1.35
1.3
1.25

You can choose the range of tempos, but use a pattern like that - go up by .1 intervals on the first three. Descend by .05 intervals on the next five. Count strokes on each repeat. SPL should decrease on the first three, and increase on the next five. Your goal is to subtract at least as many stroke at the start as you add back later. A really good result is to swim the 8th 50 with the same SPL as the first - since tempo on #8 is .05 faster.

If you don't find your weak point - as defined below - repeat the set, starting round #2 where you finished round #1
I.E.
1.25
1.35
1.45
1.4
1.35
1.3
1.25
1.2

What you're looking for with this set is to find the tempo at which you lose control. If you add, say, 2SPL at each .05 increase in tempo up to a particular point, then suddenly add 4SPL you've found the tempo where your nervous system isn't able to adapt.

Wherever you find it - let's say as you increase tempo from 1.25 to 1.2 -- that tells you two things:
1) You should concentrate a lot of your practice in a range about .1 sec above that I.E. Train quite a bit in a range from 1.25 to 1.35
2) As you approach your weak point, make smaller changes in tempo - .01 to .02 sec.

To Increase Distance
Choose a tempo very much in your comfort range, probably .3 above your weak point at first.
Swim series like this
50-100-150
OR
3 x 50 + 2 x 100 + 1 x 150
OR
50-100-150-200
OR
4 x 50 + 3 x 100 + 2 x 150 + 1 x 2 00

Same principle here. Rather than repeat distance constant and tempo changes, on this set tempo constant and repeat distance changes. Use SPL to determine where your weak point is.
As distance increases, you're good if SPL remains relatively steady. If it increases markedly when you hit 150 or 200, you know you need to strengthen that particular combination of tempo and SPL in order to swim farther without losing efficiency.

If you hit a wall too soon, try it with a slightly slower tempo and see if you can work your way up to longer swims while keeping SPL steady.

Just stay focused on finding the edge of your comfort zone and working to move it forward in baby steps.
__________________
Terry Laughlin
Head Coach & Chief Executive Optimist

May your laps be as happy as mine.

My TI Story
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-21-2011
yann yann is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Lausanne, Switzerland
Posts: 49
yann
Default Crossroads

Thank you very much Terry for the detailed instructions.

I've just realized that my question in fact is if it's worth increasing the distance at my actual tempo (1.5) or if I should improve the tempo first? At this tempo I can stay in my optimal range for my height (optimal: 35-42, actual:38-42) but I'm wondering if I'm relying too much on balance/streamlining instead of relying on balance/streamlining/propulsion?

Yann
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-21-2011
terry terry is offline
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,305
terry has disabled reputation
Default

Yann
As you probably understand, it's difficult to answer certain questions without seeing you swim, so I'd suggest - if it's not inconvenient - a session or two with a TI Coach to get feedback on what's working well and what adjustments would help maintain your learning curve.

However as I've tried to convey with my posts here and in other instances a good dose of Passionate Curiosity resulting in experiments that allow you to discover the dimensions of your comfort zone.

Both endurance and speed are based on skill. The skill of endurance is to be able to maintain fluent effective movements for longer duration. The skill of speed is to maintain them for a greater range of tempos.

You strengthen both skills the same way - by learning where your nervous system is well adapted and where it's poorly adapted.

In conventional training they advocate a form of training called Anaerobic Threshold. That's the swimming speed (or effort) at which your energy-metabolizing processes shift from aerobic metabolism -- the waste products produced by muscular activity are converted back into muscle fuel (glycogen) on a constant basis because you can supply all the oxygen required to metabolize glycogen -- to anaerobic metabolism - where the muscles demand fuel at a rate higher than you can supply oxygen. At that threshold, the body shifts to anaerobic metabolism. One result is that the waste products - primarily lactic acid - begin to accumulate in muscles and bloodstream. When this happens the muscles no longer function as well and your efficiency suffers -- i.e. shorter, less effective strokes.

So the theory goes, you need to find your threshold pace -- via test sets and certain formulas - and do lots of repeats right at it. The theory is this will gradually raise the threshold.

Because swimming performance is 80% determined by movement efficiency, rather than metabolic efficiency, it makes far more sense to me to identify the threshold via SPL and Tempo instead of theoretical formulas. SPL and Tempo are mathematically precise, specific to you (the formulas were derived from research conducted with all sorts of people -- and conducted on land, not in the water) and can be monitored in real time on every single lap, and in some ways on every single stroke (such as when you are striving to maintain, say, 40 SPL at a tempo of 1.4 for 200m). None of that is possible in Anaerobic Threshold training.

The sets I outlined are Neural Threshold training. You don't necessarily have to focus on either endurance or speed first. Researchers tell us that the brain adapts best when you vary the tasks you present -- or problems to solve -- on a fairly regular basis. There's no reason you couldn't do a set of, say 3 x 50 + 2 x 100 + 1 x 150 at a constant tempo well within your comfort zone earlier in a practice and 2 rounds of [8 x 50] at a series of tempos that move incrementally closer to your discomfort zone later.

As for your question about Balance, Streamline and Propulsion, if your SPL is still toward the upper end, and occasionally strays above, the range indicated for your height, it's likely that 80% to 90% of your focus should be on Balance and Streamline.

Another experiment in which you do a series of repeats moving from B to S to P thoughts - and monitoring both SPL and Pace (and Mojo too) - will let you know where your Propulsion-Focus Threshold is.
__________________
Terry Laughlin
Head Coach & Chief Executive Optimist

May your laps be as happy as mine.

My TI Story
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-21-2011
yann yann is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Lausanne, Switzerland
Posts: 49
yann
Default

Quote:
I'd suggest - if it's not inconvenient - a session or two with a TI Coach to get feedback on what's working well and what adjustments would help maintain your learning curve.
I tried to get training from total-immersion.ch, but unfortunately they do not offer training between Spring to Fall (!). I've also contacted an individual mentioned as a coach in Switzerland. I'll see when I can get training from him (but it's more than 3 hours driving from my place).

About the content of your advice (thank you for the long reply), I'll get that there is not one right direction to go, but one should constantly seek for new challenging goals to stay stimulated (and to avoid boredom) using SPL monitoring as a tool to stay focussed on efficiency. Therefore I'll continue within my TT comfort zone for now improving my distance, and then I'll get back to speed or whatever keep me curious and motivated. This is all about flow, isn't it?

Yann

PS: I read several of the books you mentioned in your blogs/posts with great pleasure. Presently I'm reading "the Happines Hypotheses" from Haidt which try to organize many positive psychology ideas in a coherent point of view about life and happiness. I recommend it to you if you haven't read it yet.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-23-2011
rustybc rustybc is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2
rustybc
Default

Hi Yann,

Terry's suggestions on drills should help you a lot (He is the best expert!).

One thing you might also try if you don't have ready access to a TI coach is find someone to video you above and ideally below water. You'll likely be amazed at what you see!

I believe there are some TI coaches that can help you remotely too relying on video and email/phone calls to help you. Might want to check around or contact some of the coaches in the directory to see.

Video alone should provide you some great insight into your stroke. Compare it to Terry or Shinji's videos, and make sure you are working the TI fundamental drills to find your balance and more streamlined swimming. Find focal points (front quadrant, hip rotation, breathing, etc.) and work them into your training, where you focus ONLY on 1 thing at a time... do 50 thinking only about your breathing, then 50 focused on your hip rotatation, etc. Every couple weeks, have someone video you again... compare new video to previous, see the progress and look for new opportunities for improvement.

As for me - I started a year and a half ago when I could swim 50m before I was winded. TI Easy Freestyle Book and DVD helped me quickly get the fundamentals, and then I took one weekend clinic and was able to swim 1600m non-stop the following week. Since then, I continue to tune and progress, am now able to swim up to around 4800m non-stop, and will compete in my first 10,000m open water race later this summer.

Best,
Rusty
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-23-2011
terry terry is offline
Head Coach
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 2,305
terry has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by yann View Post
Presently I'm reading "the Happines Hypotheses" from Haidt which try to organize many positive psychology ideas in a coherent point of view about life and happiness. I recommend it to you if you haven't read it yet.
I have that on my Kindle. I've dipped into it, but with your recommendation I'll dive in.
__________________
Terry Laughlin
Head Coach & Chief Executive Optimist

May your laps be as happy as mine.

My TI Story
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-24-2011
CoachDave's Avatar
CoachDave CoachDave is offline
Coach
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 249
CoachDave
Default My happy place

I have some rhythms that feel right, and others that feel totally wrong in between those rhythms.
I feel good at .96-1.02, but not from 1.03 to around 1.10. Then I have a happy place from 1.11 to 1.16, and then not so good to around 1.25. Above that, i'm in easy cruise mode, and any rate can work OK.
__________________
Dave Cameron
Total Immersion Master Coach
Head Coach- Minneapolis YWCA Otters and Masters and MN Tri Masters
www.ywcampls.org/ti
www.ywcampls.org/otters
www.distancedave.com
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:11 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.