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  #1  
Old 01-31-2014
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
Default draining the tank in age group swim training

Today I did some 100m intervals @ 95% effort, aiming to hold sub 1:30 on each.

After 8 I had had enough, but I know if I had been in a squad they would have asked me to do 20 or so until I was exhausted or until my times had dropped to 1:40 or something.

This type of draining the tank training has always been popular and I wonder if as part of a balanced training schedule it has some merits once in a while to build mental strengths and performance stamina, or should it be avoided for age groupers and left to the teenagers and elites?

As it is I look forward to this session on my schedule, if I had to do 20 I'd probably dread it?
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  #2  
Old 01-31-2014
Osmond Osmond is offline
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Andy,

What's your rest between reps? How long since your last hard workout? These are questions to ask yourself so you're aware if 8 reps was reasonable or if you're over reaching a bit.

There is validity to this type of workout for sure. By 'draining the tank' you force your body to build back stronger to compensate. If your tank is empty at 8 now instead of 20 what's wrong with doing 8? Mission accomplished!

Fueling is major as we age as well.... pre and post.(having said this I have no idea what your age is!) When we were young we could get away without balanced refuelling within 20 minutes and still go hard the next day. I find if I want to work hard 3 days in a row (1 swim, 1 bike, and 1 run) I have to super diligent with maintenance. Even 5 years ago I could cheat once in while, but not any more!

The older we get the less often we should do this, some say, or recover longer between hard workouts. (I opt for still going hard but recovering longer) Training smarter is vital too, if the schedule says 100's @ 95% but the body says tempo.... save the 100's for another day in the week.

I think there's value to hard work at any age, it keeps you young, keeps the muscle elasticity, keeps your AE higher so you can work harder. The old adage says.... use it or lose it!

Keep it up! Train smart.

S.
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  #3  
Old 01-31-2014
AWP AWP is offline
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Hey guys,
Maybe instead of a focus on 95% perceived effort(s) you can task yourself with sets designed for 95% efficiency(?).
I'll go on a limb and say with a high focus on 95% efficiency that you'd get your 95% effort.
Only, this way it would be through laser-like attention to measured aspects (ie. counting strokes/ tempo changes if using TT), along with your attention towards form, as opposed to muscling/"lasting" through a series of sets.

What am I talkin' 'bout?
Well maybe try...
Ladder set
4x50
3x100
2x150
1x200
2x150
3x100
4x50

Your task:
Choose an average spl count and hold it (perhaps within 1)...) through out the entire set! (set a reasonable rest period and be consistent)
While doing that try and also maintain pace! (do some quick math beforehand)
How'd you do? How's your effort level?
Now follow up with a series of say 50s (or 75s- 100s) and see if you can improve pace, or any other aspect, by allowing say 1-2 strokes per length more. Only add the strokes not the exertion.

I get the whole "work out" thing, I do, but I'm sure your time and efforts are best spent on a more mindful approach. If you feel the need... the need for speed, perhaps some long tune-up swims where you gradually increase pace (count strokes) feeling "pulled" towards it and not letting go. Once you feel tuned in to one aspect tune in to another and so forth. Maybe 15- 30 minutes of continuous swimming, then get to your practice sets.
I really feel it will benefit you more.

Alan
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  #4  
Old 02-01-2014
Rincewind Rincewind is offline
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High intensity training to get your heart rate to its maximum beats per minute.

The idea is not to be fully rested between intervals so that your heart rate keeps going higher.
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  #5  
Old 02-01-2014
AWP AWP is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rincewind View Post

The idea is not to be fully rested between intervals so that your heart rate keeps going higher.


I mentioned "reasonable" because it will be different for each, depending on their current level/ability.
Again the focus should be on the task not the heart beats/rate, that will surely follow, not the other way around.
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  #6  
Old 02-01-2014
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
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I think I raised the topic because my physical condition is better than my mental condition. I very rarely feel any fatigue after exercise as I don't often train over 80% perceived effort level.

After 8 intervals I leave the pool feeling ready to carry on with the day, the DIY the kids, whatever. If I did 20 I'd feel like I had had a great workout but would probably want to watch eurosport on the sofa for a couple of hours afterwards.

Also, mentally, I'm not yet prepared to exert and recover 20 times, perhaps a better way for me to deal with this is to swim 1000m with 50 hard 50 active recovery, that might be a better solution for me to get the workout I want without getting 'interval bored'?

I think I'll try a tank drain session one day when I have the option for easy recovery and see what I think of it.
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  #7  
Old 02-01-2014
Jellybean Jellybean is offline
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Jellybean
Default Draining the tank?

Andy, I can relate to this really well.

I swim with a masters club and our sessions are typical swim club interval work-outs. Late last year, I stopped doing the programmed sessions and started 100% focus on TI technique. It's going well, but it is always my concentration/coordination that fails first, i.e. my SPL rises before I feel 'worked out'. That's usually when I stop or do something else. I feel that I'm not maintaining what fitness I had.

I've countered this a bit by swimming more of the other strokes in the usual work-out way. For example, when my SPL rises too much, I'll switch to back stroke or breast stroke and swim at the back of my group. Perhaps you could try that too.

I think it won't be too long before I can swim the masters programmes with TI technique, but it's hard to be patient and watch your fitness decilne when it's so hard to get in our mature years (55 yrs for me).

I'd appreciate any other ideas for maintaining swimming fitness while doing the patient work to master the TI skills.

Cheers
Tony
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  #8  
Old 02-02-2014
jenson1a jenson1a is offline
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jenson1a
Default What Timing

This may help

I just got an email that Terry is having another webinar on Monday from 8 to 9 p.m. E.S.T. It covers the very thing that has been brought up in this thread.This webinar will be recorded and can be viewed later.

Looking forward to what Terry has to say

Sherry
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  #9  
Old 02-03-2014
Talvi Talvi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jellybean View Post
Andy, I can relate to this really well.... it's hard to be patient and watch your fitness decilne when it's so hard to get in our mature years....
I've been exclusively focusing on TI form for the last 9 months and was saddened to find how unfit I was when I went back to XC-skiing. I'm at a low level of fitness etc but had been expecting a payback from 2-3 km sessions, 2-3 times a week in the pool. Perhaps though it's just different exercise exercising different muscles etc?

Andy, there's some research I saw (Jamie Timmons, professor of systems biology, Nottingham University - High Intensity Impact Training HIIT) regarding fitness, from a health rather than performance perspective, maybe suggesting that intensive exercise for very short periods e.g 3x 30 sec bursts may be a good route fwiw

@Sherry: Do you have a link for the webinar?
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A psychological disorder is: "Any personal construction which is used repeatedly in spite of consistent invalidation."
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Last edited by Talvi : 02-03-2014 at 09:14 AM.
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  #10  
Old 02-03-2014
jenson1a jenson1a is offline
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I just received another email about that webinar and I think it is only for members of the TI Academy. I am not a member, and no link was provided. Maybe other readers can shed more light on this.

Sherry
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