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  #1  
Old 06-20-2009
shuumai shuumai is offline
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Default Dragging Forearms

OK, so my wife spied me attempting 50-yard butterfly repeats. (Just going 50 yards, especially more than once, is pretty good for me.) The thing is, she noticed that my forearms are dragging a little during the second half of the recovery. She said my arms are very low over the water. What can I work on to improve the second half of the recovery? (I know I could use more flexibility in the shoulders.)

I don't have any video and this is the first feedback that I've been given in a while. The good thing about it is that I wasn't aware of being watched, so I was being more natural during the repeats.
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  #2  
Old 06-20-2009
shuumai shuumai is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splashingpat View Post
I always watch swimmer, and tryin' my best NOT to give feedback!
even if I am asked (NOW!)

But for you....
maybe the kick is needed....

or maybe just a little more practice,
Pat
Right. I've been trying to relax at the knees more during the upward undulation and making changes to the timing of the kick-your-hands-out phase. I was thinking that the kick might be happening too early and not allowing my body to rise as high. Sometimes I don't kick at all, but just "brace" with my legs. I don't know if that makes a difference because I didn't even know I had a problem before. heh

I thought of something just after I sent the first post out. I've put emphasis on having my head return to the water before my hands enter. Maybe that combined with lack of flexibility is pulling my arms down too early.

One good thing: My fitness and/or relaxation must have improved because, even with that drag during recovery, I'm swimming a little further than before.
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  #3  
Old 06-21-2009
daveblt daveblt is offline
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Default

The last time I checked myself on video doing butterfly ,which is not really my best stroke though working on it , my arms were dragging a little also however if the arms are just low over the water and not dragging that's not a bad thing! Anyway here are some things we can do to help the arms clear the water.

- Don't dive down too much on entry
- Try to keep keep body undulations and core motions ahead of the arms
- Enter the arms gently at the surface while landing them and let them go forward without pressing them down shoulder width apart
- Sink the chest as the hands go forward
- wait for the hips to rise before you try to do the arm recovery
- try to let the hands leave the water early for the recovery without pushing back all the way and don't let the hands go too deep on the pull
- the second phase of the undulation should help kick your hands out of the water


Dave
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Old 06-21-2009
shuumai shuumai is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splashingpat View Post
Shinji 'svideo is different than most butterfly swimmers I see,
Watching Shinji-san, it seems that his recovery is faster that mine feels. Maybe a faster recovery would help.
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  #5  
Old 06-22-2009
shuumai shuumai is offline
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This video shows a bunch of people doing butterfly. One guy highlights the problem of kicking too early before the recovery. His pass starts around 2:50.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bG-_ejYocFs
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  #6  
Old 07-27-2009
ayesr ayesr is offline
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Default On this same issue "...dragging forearms..."

Did a lot of BFs (using the MFs as transition stroke). And towards the end, after about 30+ laps (my target was 60 X 25M of BF/MF) my arms were dragging, so much so I was scooping water with 'em.

I guess I was just tired. Will see if there are any prolonged muscle pains not due to tiredness...

The point being...is there a dry-land exercise - non-weights - to strenghten the muscles we use for the BF?

FYI, the foot-flick really does work. It lifted my upper body easily for a relaxed breathing/recovery process. As a drill, I used the superman position - instead of the flutter - with the focus on the foot-flick underwater. I can see the tiles moving fast. It does work.

End.
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  #7  
Old 07-27-2009
shuumai shuumai is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ayesr View Post
Did a lot of BFs (using the MFs as transition stroke). And towards the end, after about 30+ laps (my target was 60 X 25M of BF/MF) my arms were dragging, so much so I was scooping water with 'em.

I guess I was just tired. Will see if there are any prolonged muscle pains not due to tiredness...

The point being...is there a dry-land exercise - non-weights - to strenghten the muscles we use for the BF?

FYI, the foot-flick really does work. It lifted my upper body easily for a relaxed breathing/recovery process. As a drill, I used the superman position - instead of the flutter - with the focus on the foot-flick underwater. I can see the tiles moving fast. It does work.

End.
I suppose some good exercises would be jumping jacks, crunches, and maybe pull ups.

I'm having a hard time following what you're saying. Does BF=butterfly and MF=minifly? The Superman position...was that the focal point for the hand entry?
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  #8  
Old 07-27-2009
ayesr ayesr is offline
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Default BF is butterfly, MF is minifly, etc.

Yes, you are right, Shu.

I used the superman position to focus on the foot-flick (not for the hand entry).

Thanks for the suggestions. I already do some of these. I will just need to do more repetitions and add the others...

Again thanks.

End.
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  #9  
Old 07-28-2009
shuumai shuumai is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ayesr View Post
I used the superman position to focus on the foot-flick (not for the hand entry).
Then which part of the cycle were you working on? Catch?
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  #10  
Old 07-28-2009
ayesr ayesr is offline
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Default "...which part of the cycle..."

I was working on getting the timing and feel for the foot-flick. And finding out how effective it is. And if there were muscle issues after the repeats, considering the muscle set that I was using.

Incorporated into the whole stroke, the foot-flick comes in as my arms reach - almost - my hips, and the flick provides the lift to do the sneaky breath, and clear the arms up and out of the water for these arms to move and fall in the upper quadrant. The flick also assists in the overall forward propulsion.

End.
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