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  #11  
Old 01-10-2012
arunks arunks is offline
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While I was practcing today I felt i was getting a good catch because of how i initiated the catch.Tipping the wrists before the forearm drops under the elbow definitely helps the cause.
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  #12  
Old 01-10-2012
ashby ashby is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andyinnorway View Post
If it hurts stop.

Try this instead.

pretend you are holding two ski poles with your elbows by your waist.

now lift your elbows up like a bird flapping its wings and hold at shoulder height. (a bit like you have a 1m broom handle, one end in each hand and the broom handle is parallel to your eyes and the length of your forearm in front of them).

now stand up if you are not already and bend over, without moving your arms. both your arms should now be in early vertical catch position as they would be in the water.

open up one elbow and it is in spear position? that's it.

just takes a bit of figuring out to do the reverse way for swimming. the angle of the upper arm has to be correct to avoid shoulder rotation. elbow bone and tricep are facing the ceiling, bicep facing the bottom of the pool/floor.

just write back if that doesn't help either. this is only how i see it, the coaches do not confirm or deny my thoughts on this.
OK thanks that works. Isn't that in the pull position not the catch though? Or am I confused?
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  #13  
Old 01-10-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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the start of the pull is the end of the catch so as per the explanation below. once you are bent over with your arm and elbow at 90 deg. If you extend your elbow out straight again then you are effectively doing a reverse catch.

Its a great drill to do superman glide then at the end do prepare your catch 2 or 3 times each side without stroking then stand up.

It helps you realise that the two parts of the stroke are different and that the elbow stays forward for the catch.
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  #14  
Old 01-10-2012
swimmermike swimmermike is offline
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Hi Andy

Would that be the skatch drill, exemplified in the video sent by Coach Suzanne a couple of days ago?
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  #15  
Old 01-11-2012
MakoMike MakoMike is offline
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I am still not sure about this. When the catch starts I am on my side. Which direction should my hand go to start the catch? Vertically down relative to me isn't the same as vertically down relative to the pool. If it is vertically down relative to me, my hand crosses over. If it is relative to the pool, then its very difficult to keep my upper arm pointing forward and my forearm at 90 degrees pointing towards the pool bottom unless I have rubber shoulders. If I wait until I have rotated back to being on my front there seems to be too much delay. Any clarification would be much appreciated. I know that some people seem to keep a straight arm at the start of the catch, which doesn't present a problem. Its the high elbow 90 degree position that I find a problem.
Mike

Last edited by MakoMike : 01-11-2012 at 11:10 AM.
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  #16  
Old 01-11-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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don't know about the video suzanne sent you but probably, but your description on hand position it sounds like you may be over rotated. you hand should be on wide tracks when you initiate the catch, not under the body?


this is a good non elite video of a guy I have been watching today, his youtube channel says he swims 1,500m in 20.40, which is where I would like to be in a couple of years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfJJi76qAn8

His stroke is very TI and probably is a member of this forum, don't know.

anyway, lots of good catch's here for you to watch. sometimes its harder with the olympians because they swim so fast it looks abnormal.
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  #17  
Old 01-11-2012
swimmermike swimmermike is offline
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MakoMike

For the lead hand, if you start with a relaxed hand, fingers down, then allowthe forearm to drop as you rotate, the lead hand will come toward the midline (see videos of Terry and Shinji in the catch). This is not the same as the spearing hand/arm "crossing the midline" as it aims for its target on the tracks. The stroking hand goes straight back from this point, on a track.

The body rotation allow the shoulder movement without needing "rubber shoulders."

Hope that helps.
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  #18  
Old 01-11-2012
drmike drmike is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andyinnorway View Post
don't know about the video suzanne sent you but probably, but your description on hand position it sounds like you may be over rotated. you hand should be on wide tracks when you initiate the catch, not under the body?


this is a good non elite video of a guy I have been watching today, his youtube channel says he swims 1,500m in 20.40, which is where I would like to be in a couple of years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfJJi76qAn8

His stroke is very TI and probably is a member of this forum, don't know.

anyway, lots of good catch's here for you to watch. sometimes its harder with the olympians because they swim so fast it looks abnormal.
One doesn't argue with success (times), but to me it seems that guy's stroke would require iron-strong, non-fatigable shoulders. Doesn't most of his rotation occur well after the pull is complete, and if so, is core rotation really providing much oomph in this case?

Mike M.
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  #19  
Old 01-11-2012
MakoMike MakoMike is offline
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Thanks Andy for video and Mike's for comments. I'm going to study that video and give this a bit of thought.
Mike
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  #20  
Old 01-11-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmike View Post
One doesn't argue with success (times), but to me it seems that guy's stroke would require iron-strong, non-fatigable shoulders. Doesn't most of his rotation occur well after the pull is complete, and if so, is core rotation really providing much oomph in this case?

Mike M.

i see it more as he is setting the catch up and then rotating with the pull part of the stroke, looking at it again he does seem a bit late sometimes on one side but I guess that depends on what is happening over the water.

the main reason to show the video was for the catch in slow motion of a non elite swimmer but showing that there are two distinct parts to the stroke, get the forearm vertical then start the pull.
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