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  #1  
Old 01-08-2012
MakoMike MakoMike is offline
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MakoMike
Default Catch

Could you good swimmers out there describe exactly what you do to set up the catch? From the point where the lead arm is fully extended what comes next? I can see from the videos what it looks like but I'm interested to know what exact movement you feel you are doing at that point. I'm asking because it is a bit hit and miss with me. The more I concentrate on it the less certain I am what I'm trying to do.
Mike
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  #2  
Old 01-08-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
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Imagine you are on a high bench like a massage table with your elbows lined up with the edge of the bed and your arms outstretched.

Now relax your elbow so that hand and forearm are flopped perpendicularly over the bed edge. This movement for me a is a simple relaxed catch.

The shoulder isn't stressed during the movement but note how the hand moves in slightly from its outstretched position.

Also to allow the forearm to just flop into position your elbow must be angled slightly upward when outstretched, otherwise the forearm will just move sideways not downwards.

I would encourage you to practise this on dry land and get used to moving the forearm into position without moving the elbow back. Some people like to imagine the elbow lifting and inch or so but its not necessary.

Once you can get the arm in a relaxed catch position your pull phase will be more relaxed, engage the lats not the shoulder and help you maintain a consistent SPL especially over longer distances.

Any problems just ask more questions.
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  #3  
Old 01-08-2012
arunks arunks is offline
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arunks
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A picture speaks a thousand words.Attached are the pics of TI Coaches(Terry, Shinji, Suzanne) and others setting up the catch in the FQ.This should give a good idea about catch as an add-on to Andy's advice.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Coach Terry FQ.jpg (65.0 KB, 89 views)
File Type: jpg Coach Shinji FQ.jpg (49.2 KB, 87 views)
File Type: jpg Coach Suzanne FQ.jpg (48.1 KB, 89 views)
File Type: jpg Sunyang pic2.jpg (67.2 KB, 85 views)
File Type: jpg KPN1.jpg (43.1 KB, 82 views)

Last edited by arunks : 01-08-2012 at 04:17 PM.
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  #4  
Old 01-08-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
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I think mine looks most like the last one (pink swim suit) but until I confirm that with some underwater video I cannot confirm, it feels like that anyway.

TI coach Dave also has a good video on the catch

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDmQi...ture=endscreen
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  #5  
Old 01-08-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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edit, the more I release my head the harder I find it to get high elbow catch and so it feels more like Terry's and Shinjis when I fully release my head.
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  #6  
Old 01-08-2012
MakoMike MakoMike is offline
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Thanks for the advice. Andy, you say the forearm just flops into position. Just to be clear does this mean that you are not using much muscle power until after the catch?

Another thing I'm not sure of is this: Its not difficult to get my forearm to flop down if I'm lying on my front but at the point where the catch begins on, say, the left side, I am actually lying on my left side. Then its much more difficult to get my forearm to go vertically downwards.
Mike
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  #7  
Old 01-09-2012
arunks arunks is offline
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arunks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MakoMike View Post
Just to be clear does this mean that you are not using much muscle power until after the catch?
Yes, that's right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MakoMike View Post
Its not difficult to get my forearm to flop down if I'm lying on my front but at the point where the catch begins on, say, the left side, I am actually lying on my left side. Then its much more difficult to get my forearm to go vertically downwards.
Here is a previous thread with a discussion on flop...Hope it helps.
Click here.
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  #8  
Old 01-09-2012
ashby ashby is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andyinnorway View Post
Imagine you are on a high bench like a massage table with your elbows lined up with the edge of the bed and your arms outstretched.

Now relax your elbow so that hand and forearm are flopped perpendicularly over the bed edge. This movement for me a is a simple relaxed catch.

The shoulder isn't stressed during the movement but note how the hand moves in slightly from its outstretched position.
Hi Andy, i just tried this on my bed and it hurt my shoulders a lot, it really twists them what am I doing wrong?!
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  #9  
Old 01-09-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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If it hurts stop.

Try this instead.

pretend you are holding two ski poles with your elbows by your waist.

now lift your elbows up like a bird flapping its wings and hold at shoulder height. (a bit like you have a 1m broom handle, one end in each hand and the broom handle is parallel to your eyes and the length of your forearm in front of them).

now stand up if you are not already and bend over, without moving your arms. both your arms should now be in early vertical catch position as they would be in the water.

open up one elbow and it is in spear position? that's it.

just takes a bit of figuring out to do the reverse way for swimming. the angle of the upper arm has to be correct to avoid shoulder rotation. elbow bone and tricep are facing the ceiling, bicep facing the bottom of the pool/floor.

just write back if that doesn't help either. this is only how i see it, the coaches do not confirm or deny my thoughts on this.
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  #10  
Old 01-09-2012
Janos Janos is offline
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Not sure if flop is the correct terminology here. The leading arm yields to the oncoming resistance in proportion to your forward momentum. As it does so, you should not lose your 'feel' for the viscosity or thickness of the water, so when your catch arm is at its most vertical point, you are getting maximum grip. the catch position means an internal rotation of the shoulder. You can mimic this by raising one arm above your head as far as it will go, and then lower your hand, flexing at the elbow. it is important to keep the elbow still. Practice grip in the water by sculling when resting at the end of laps.

Regards

Janos
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