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-   -   Freestyle love/hate relationship (http://www.totalimmersion.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9236)

Talvi 10-22-2017 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 63398)
Hi Talvi, the link I sent you above has no pictures which makes it difficult to understand. There are other links with pictures, which may be better.

There are all sorts of ways to accomplish the same thing. In my case the key issue is to keep my shoulders back (with the blades squeezing together a little) and not to slump forward. When I do this, my shoulder mobility increases significantly.

Hi Danny,

A late question about this, do you mean you do this while swimming or on dry land? I don't think shoulder mobility is a problem for me generally. My shoulders are rather too loose for my age, meaning that their "clicking" is the problem rather than their stiffness.

Danny 10-22-2017 01:56 PM

Hi Talvi,

The shoulders are a very complicated joint and I am no expert. Your problems may be different from mine, so I am not sure what works for me will work for you. In my case, it was my range of motion which was limited, in part because of an old injury. Keeping my shoulders back seemed to increase my range of motion. In a recent post, someone spoke about "hollow body exercises" in gymnastics and pointed out to me that the trick was not to keep your shoulders back but rather down. I discovered that this made a big difference for me. All of this helps to improve my posture and how motion transmits between upper and lower body, but it also helps my shoulder range of motion. That's for motion out of the pool. In the pool things are more complicated because the shoulders are moving forward and backward, but I do have the feeling that having good posture in the pool also increases my shoulders' range of motion and the comfort I have moving my shoulders.

liolio 03-02-2018 09:30 AM

Short update. My technique is definitely improve, I would dare say a lot.
I still have issue with posture and my managing of proprioceptive information but I've made strides. I think I'm finding "my line" (applies to land too).

I start to enjoy freestyle actually as I only do short length it feels really fast at time. I'm a lot more comfortable breathing on both sides, as somebody posted here I think my left side is indeed cleaner. I've grown well aware about how breathing on one side alter you technique and so the strain on your body (for those that are not built as solid, tough or resilient as others...). I'm holding on doing significant distance and volume at the moment but I still feel like one breath every 3 strokes may be a little to few for me, I may want to stick with a regular pattern that includes more breathing 3/2/2/3/2/2 for example.
Still no luck with the 2 breaths out of three strokes advocated by Gary Hall Sr. May be I will find a way to make it work... one day lol

Other than that along with finding my line I got a better grip on my body rotation. Overall I swimming straighter and my rotation is more symmetrical. Though the rotation "breaks" easier than the line.

As for health well, still hurting here and there, I've to be patient, bad posture for decades took its toll as well as not properly dealt with injury. A focus at the moment is stabilizing the right shoulder, my anatomy lessons comes handy here.
I work on all four strokes, I try not to do breaststroke too much as i realize that it is really tough to resist "the bent or torsion" as large legs muscles engage.
Butterfly is improving I hope for a breakthrough soon.

CoachBobM 03-02-2018 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by liolio (Post 64872)
I'm a lot more comfortable breathing on both sides, as somebody posted here I think my left side is indeed cleaner. I've grown well aware about how breathing on one side alter you technique and so the strain on your body (for those that are not built as solid, tough or resilient as others...). I'm holding on doing significant distance and volume at the moment but I still feel like one breath every 3 strokes may be a little to few for me, I may want to stick with a regular pattern that includes more breathing 3/2/2/3/2/2 for example.
Still no luck with the 2 breaths out of three strokes advocated by Gary Hall Sr. May be I will find a way to make it work... one day lol

Keep in mind that the important thing is to be breathing equal amounts of the time on both sides, not how you accomplish that. I can breathe every 3 strokes for short distances, but for longer swims, I usually breathe twice on the right, then twice on the left, and so on, and sometimes even switch to 3 breaths on the right followed by 3 breaths on the left, etc.


Bob

AnnaMarsh 03-05-2018 05:33 AM

nice post.

thaddeus.ward@gmail.com 03-05-2018 03:03 PM

I am a noob (8 months) who seems to have had a pretty easy time of it. I also totally relate to your struggles with breathing and technique. I recently had an issue where my breathing froze up over the course of a couple of sessions and I had to figure out how to unwind it. (Look for the post; "HELP all of a sudden I can't breath" in the O2 in H20 forum.)

two thoughts that might be helpful.
1) SLOW DOWN...I've found that practicing at a super slow rate and with absolutely minimal effort reveals all flaws in my balance and, because I am moving slow enough, start to address them. Going slow also revealed to me how the challenge is less about 'breathing hard' than breathing in the right cadence.

2) Balance breathing over time, not every time. As Terry put it for folks, try to have roughly equal breathing over the course of your swim. Warming up I will keep 4 breaths on 1 side before switching. Once warm I will do 3 on 1 side before switching, and occasionally flirt with just 2. If I feel my chest get tight I will spend a little more time on the same side. Additionally, I will speed up my stroke cadence when I do the switch. (switch is 3 strokes before breathing) This is something I am still working on but I like where it is headed. This brings my stroke cadence into more alignment with my breathing.

Just thoughts.

The Most Important thing is awareness and finding a way to enjoy the journey of discovery. With those two elements everything else will fall into place eventually.

whoiscathy 03-08-2018 07:36 AM

Hijack
 
I noticed (to late) that I managed to hijack OP's thread with my video. Since the topic was tangentially related so I posted too quick. I apologize. I'll post these things into a separate thread.

whoiscathy 03-08-2018 02:30 PM

My comments and the responses that were obviously for me have been moved to a new thread. (Thanks, Johnny!)

So I'm done with hijacking ;)

liolio 08-04-2018 11:55 AM

Update. Lots of time have passed sine my last post.
I'm still struggling with myself especially when it comes to maintain a proper form/sttroke though at this point it has more to do with my physical condition than technique per SE.
I've made breakthrough in all the stroke even butterfly starts to make sense.

To narrow things to front crawling I'm still prone to hyper ventilation (for not emptying my lgs properly but I made strides on every aspect of the stroke.
I've found as another member said that breathing on my non natural side is doing me a lot of good.
First I breath pretty well on that side even though it does not feel natural but it also force me to do a more accurate left arm motion. A Win-Win situation.

Still not my favorite stroke but at the moment I avoid symmetri stroke as much as possible as I found it is not the best way to fight my asymmetries (muscles, stance, etc.).

I'm pretty fast, I below 40s without diving on a 50m (one length). I would bet I can get in the +/- 30s on a proper sprint with diving.

liolio 08-09-2018 10:58 PM

More love
 
It is more and more of a love relation with front crawl I've to say. It seems that this stroke does my multiple issues more good that the others strokes even the so advertized backstroke.

I'm training to get comfortable taking two breaths in a row. Two breaths on three strokes do me good on 50 possibly 100m. I'm also learning to do it "on demand" blending it in more standard breathign patern.
I'm short with 3 strokes on breath on more than a couple 50m laps, I may move the 2 breaths followed by two or this strokes.
Still experimeting but it may work for me, I did not put enough times in my previous trials I think.


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