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  #1  
Old 04-19-2010
Alex-SG Alex-SG is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Dubai
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Alex-SG
Default ZEN Skate Drill: Land vs. Water

When I am not able to go to the pool I like working on ZEN Skating (Zipper Skate) on my livingroom floor (High leading elbows, marionnette arm, finger tips at floor level).

NOW here is the problem: on the floor our body is ON TOP of the floor whereas in the water we are partly submerged.

So our Pool Recovery elbow/arm/hand position cannot be the same as our LivingRoom Recovery elbow/arm/hand position... otherwise we end-up with a hand 10cm below the water surface.

How should I adjust my LivingRoom drilling so that the exact same movement/feeling can be used at the pool? Should I practice with my hand 10cm (or more) above the floor? Any other adjustment?

NOTE: I noticed that in my living room my recovery elbow is well ahead of my arm/hand. On the other hand in the water the recovery arm/hand is 45degrees in front (can see when breathing). Could it be that in an effort not to have the hand in the water during recovery I have developed a habit to lead with the hand ?

Thanks. ALEX
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  #2  
Old 04-19-2010
CoachEricDeSanto CoachEricDeSanto is offline
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Alex,
I would say the most important thing about this drill, either on land or in water is to keep the elbow gut side of the body. You do not want a straight line from shoulder - shoulder - elbow! It stops the very common tendency to lift the elbow above your body.

So I don't worry so much about the height. If you over exaggerate the bend at the shoulder, I consider that a good thing. I practice drawing tear drops on the floor to develop the idea of an out-swinging recovery. I also use this to introduce the feeling of stretch in the top armpit as you reach entry point. Both of these are demonstrated well even if the arm is a little low.

If you want the movements to be exact, the water level would be just below the front of the top shoulder, so drag the fingers at that height. Remember that you want to lift the elbow very little. The rest of the height comes from straightening the arm some (like from 90 degrees to 45 or so).
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  #3  
Old 04-22-2010
Alex-SG Alex-SG is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachEricD View Post
Alex,
I would say the most important thing about this drill, either on land or in water is to keep the elbow gut side of the body....

If you want the movements to be exact, the water level would be just below the front of the top shoulder, so drag the fingers at that height. Remember that you want to lift the elbow very little. The rest of the height comes from straightening the arm some (like from 90 degrees to 45 or so).
To make sure I understand correctly... let's take as an example the IMAGE on the TI HOME PAGE. Looks like this swimmer does have a line going from shoulder-shoulder-elbow.

What would be the correct elbow position on this picture? How many degrees from the water surface?

Other question: Is the angle of the elbow from the front view supposed to be 90degrees (upperarm-elbow-forearm)?

Thanks. ALEX
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  #4  
Old 04-22-2010
CoachEricDeSanto CoachEricDeSanto is offline
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That image is an older image that does not show the wide track concept we have been teaching lately. I would widen the elbow to over 90 degree bend, keep the fingers as close to the surface as possible while keeping the body in a similar place. That would create an angle in the shoulder that eases strain on the shoulder.

I don't like giving specific angles because the body is changing position constantly so the angles are changing. Also, As the tempo increases, the angles will change. That is a problem that we got into in older versions of our work based more on the training of elite swimmers. Elite athletes make adjustments naturally where us mortals are more likely to take details as absolute.

The easiest example of this is hand entry point. The goal is to get the hand into the water silently. As speed increases, the entry point will move slightly forward. If you train for silence, you will be forced to make adjustments as your speed changes. So, when people try to discuss entering near the head, or at the elbow, those are only set to one speed. When people study elite athletes and say that they enter farther forward, that is because at 50 sec/100 that makes a silent entry for that athlete.

So, the angles of the body and shoulder will change as your stroke tempo changes. There is no "correct" angle. What you are looking for is the width that allows you to recover with the least possible effort at whatever tempo you are swimming.

Use the dry land drill to imprint the sensation of zero strain and zero tension.
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  #5  
Old 04-23-2010
Alex-SG Alex-SG is offline
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Thanks CoachERIC. Very informative. ALEX
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  #6  
Old 04-23-2010
ewa.swimmer ewa.swimmer is offline
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ewa.swimmer
Default Weird Ones

Oh, aren't we TI swimmers such a crazy bunch. We just can't get enough and are always thinking about how to improve our stroke even when we are not in the water. Visualizing sometimes is just not enough. Sometimes my family thinks I have "lost it." when they come into the room and I am standing trying to figure out something with my stroke. At open water camp in Kona we were waiting before our night manta ray snorkel and talking about the two beat kick. One of the swimmers wanted to "feel" what we were talking about and went and laid on a boulder so her legs could be free and tried some things.
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