Total Immersion Forums  

Go Back   Total Immersion Forums > Favorite Practices and Sets
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 12-08-2013
AWP AWP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 575
AWP
Default

Terry took the words right out of my mouth ; )
Just want to 'concur' this approach works, even hastens improvement once you find @ which tempos you falter and where you feel good.
Narrowing the aperture (TT range), so to speak, brings your ATP picture into focus.
I'll share a bit of what I did yesterday morning:
TT setting: 1.20 for a tune-up
TT setting: 1.15>1.17>1.18<1.16<1.14
TT setting: 1.12>1.14>1.15<1.13<1.11
TT setting 1.20 efficiency check

Distances: 200>150>100<150<200
I wanted to gain DPS (distance per stroke) as tempo slowed without actually slowing but maintaining pace. By shortening distance I don't 'use up' that hold so much as tempo increases. I wanted to finish each round with the higher tempo/longer distance combo because that just happens to be my focus at the moment; improve my overall pace/hold over longer distances.
When I do this again I'll probably check times on the 'middle' combos (1.17, 1.14) which usually feel best and finish times because I want to eventually up and improve range/speed/pace and overall comfort as I go.

I don't usually worry about time initially, just grooving to tempo changes and how 'efficient' I can maintain each length playing with stroke counts ( I won't proceed if some part of my swimming feels off. I'll focus on getting that first usually w/o TT then proceed).
When I find what feels good I note the combination. When I become accustomed to a narrowed range of tempos, I'll then either improve further with them through marked times or extending distances.
Otherwise I'll start and finish with a combination that feels just out of my comfort and find problems to solve or improve upon.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-08-2013
WFEGb WFEGb is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Hamburg
Posts: 1,104
WFEGb
Default

Hello Terry,

that's very good news! Date and time will be a bit difficult for me. May be I have to miss the first on Saturday 15th. But please book me in.

Thanks for your ATP-hints. I'll give them some weeks tries as soon as my (heavy) cold lets me go back.

Best regards,
Werner
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-09-2013
Talvi Talvi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Lappeenranta, Finland
Posts: 1,675
Talvi
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by terry View Post
...Practice should be motivated by a spirit of curiosity as much as by the Kaizen quest for improvement.
Beautiful advice Terry, thanks. Enjoyment always seems to get me so much further than stuggle.

What is your advice on at what point a TT becomes really helpful?

I would say my focus is more a curiosity in improving technique and making it consistent, flowing and efficient. By doing so I am assuming improvement in pace etc will naturally result.
__________________
A psychological disorder is: "Any personal construction which is used repeatedly in spite of consistent invalidation."
~ George Kelly

"The water is your friend.....you don't have to fight with water, just share the same spirit as the water, and it will help you move."
~ Aleksandr Popov
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-12-2013
swim2Bfree swim2Bfree is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: N. California
Posts: 179
swim2Bfree
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by terry View Post
SwimSmooth has made some waves among triathletes by advocating an approach that's starkly different from TI.

The most critical distinction is that we believe speed must be based on a solid foundation of Stroke Length, and to build Tempo patiently, allowing the nervous and metabolic systems to adapt to each new level of tempo.

In contrast, they seem to feel that there's no swimming problem that can't be solved by stroking faster.
These comments reflect either a woeful misunderstanding of Swim Smooth's methods, or a transparent strawman tactic.

Terry, are you frustrated that Swim Smooth continues to chip away at your market share?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-12-2013
CoachStuartMcDougal's Avatar
CoachStuartMcDougal CoachStuartMcDougal is offline
coach
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,353
CoachStuartMcDougal
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by swim2Bfree View Post
These comments reflect either a woeful misunderstanding of Swim Smooth's methods, or a transparent strawman tactic.

Terry, are you frustrated that Swim Smooth continues to chip away at your market share?
Swim2Bfree! Haven't seen/heard from you for awhile. But maybe I've missed your posts. Terry is spot on, he's only contrasting and challenging the SRRT and SS perception, nothing insecure as you note. I have found the SRRT useless, but I'm sure there are those that have found it useful.

I just joined the South End Rowing Club in San Francisco, and remember you're a member too. It's a grrreat club, terrific folks and some incredible history there. It's wonderful to swim in AP, my fav swimming hole - and love the post swim sauna- NICE! I hope to do the SERC New Years Alcatraz swim but didn't have a chance to do the qualifying swim Dec 8. I hope to convince Diana and/or Pauline that I've done enough Alcatraz crossings to do the swim. Will you be doing this one? Love to swim with ya and break in the swimming New Year.

Stuart
MindBodyAndSWIM
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-12-2013
swim2Bfree swim2Bfree is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: N. California
Posts: 179
swim2Bfree
Default

Hi Stuart, I'll be there for the NYD Alcatraz. The main thing Dianna and Pauline are concerned about is that you're not going to be a danger to yourself and others - especially given the unseasonably cold water temps we've been experiencing (already hovering right at 50F). Wouldn't be surprised if it's 48 by NYD. Doing the qualifier, or swimming regularly in AP, is one way to demonstrate this. Do you plan to wear a wetsuit?

Back to the original topic, do think it's a fair description of SS to say, as Terry does, "they seem to feel that there's no swimming problem that can't be solved by stroking faster" ?
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-12-2013
CoachStuartMcDougal's Avatar
CoachStuartMcDougal CoachStuartMcDougal is offline
coach
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,353
CoachStuartMcDougal
Default

Hi Swim2BFree,

Got it thanks, and understand Pauline and Diana want to make sure swimmers are not a danger to themselves or others. Yeah, I've see the recent temps, 48 degs burrrr. I swam AP weekend before TG, water a balmy 52, air temp same. I wore my sleevelss shorty, couple of thick caps and ear plugs, and after inital shock, swam for about an hour. But was idle a lot taking pictures and video too - don't get to swim AP very often. 48 degs is pretty darn cold, haven't swam below 50 degs before. But would defintely wear my shorty, caps, ear plugs for sure. I'll see Pauling and Diana say and will heed whatever they think is right. If no swim, I may come out and volunteer.

Re: Fair description. Yes, and I would probably add, high turnover is priority. Namely anything faster than 60 spm. SRRT seems evident of that.

Stuart
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-12-2013
Ghul Ghul is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 59
Ghul
Default

Saying that SS is all about stroke rate is clearly a caricature but perhaps
no worse than saying TI is all about over-gliding..... On the topic at hand
I haven't found the ramp test very useful. I think the idea is to locate a
swimmer's ideal tempo but I've never found it very precise. The tempo pyramid
on the other hand I have found very useful in improving my ability to maintain
efficiency as the stroke rate varies.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-13-2013
CharlesCouturier CharlesCouturier is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,244
CharlesCouturier
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghul View Post
Saying that SS is all about stroke rate is clearly a caricature but perhaps
no worse than saying TI is all about over-gliding.....
Bingo......
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-13-2013
CoachSuzanne CoachSuzanne is offline
Coach
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,453
CoachSuzanne
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AWP View Post
Terry took the words right out of my mouth ; )
Just want to 'concur' this approach works, even hastens improvement once you find @ which tempos you falter and where you feel good.
Narrowing the aperture (TT range), so to speak, brings your ATP picture into focus.
I'll share a bit of what I did yesterday morning:
TT setting: 1.20 for a tune-up
TT setting: 1.15>1.17>1.18<1.16<1.14
TT setting: 1.12>1.14>1.15<1.13<1.11
TT setting 1.20 efficiency check

Distances: 200>150>100<150<200
Alan, this is a nice elegant set, as is your notation. :)

QUestion, are the distances how you did each repeat within each row of your "TT Setting" entries? e.g. did you do 4 repeats of 200-150-100-150-200, with the first and last all at 1.20, and the middle 2 at the changes you noted?

THank you for your insights.
__________________
Suzanne Atkinson, MD
Coach of 4 time USA Triathlon Triathlete of the Year, Kirsten Sass
Steel City Endurance, LTD
Fresh Freestyle

Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are Off
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:35 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.