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  #1  
Old 12-16-2009
inca inca is offline
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Default Trying to "get" the breathing

Sometimes I'll turn to breathe and it's OK, sometimes I can only get water. I've read the posts with the suggestions as to what issues to check but without feedback from someone watching me it is hard for me to figure it out. At this point, I think I am just trying to get that breath at the wrong time within the stroke. It seems to me that I should take the breath at the moment at the end of the pull (just at the point where I am bringing the arm back towards the front, with my elbow high).

Can anyone tell me the correlation (timing) between taking the breath and the arm positions?
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Old 12-16-2009
atreides atreides is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inca View Post
Sometimes I'll turn to breathe and it's OK, sometimes I can only get water. I've read the posts with the suggestions as to what issues to check but without feedback from someone watching me it is hard for me to figure it out. At this point, I think I am just trying to get that breath at the wrong time within the stroke. It seems to me that I should take the breath at the moment at the end of the pull (just at the point where I am bringing the arm back towards the front, with my elbow high).

Can anyone tell me the correlation (timing) between taking the breath and the arm positions?
I think that is too late. Since I think that your rotation and pull should be nearly simultaneous, you can begin to breathe as you begin to pull. By the time you are recovering on that pull, you should have rolled your head back into the water preparing to drive your hip and pull on the other side.

By the time that I have driven my recovery hand to its target, I'm rotating over on it ( and keeping my lead hand patient) so that when I begin my pull I can almost begin my breathing. I'm probably mid-pull when I take a breath but my head doesn't go back in until my arm is in mid recovery. The only time I get water is when I'm trying to keep my head movement to a minimum. I think that if you are not staying patient on the lead hand, your pull may begin before your other arm has recovered in the water (and before you have driven your hip) so that when you turn to breathe, its already time to roll back into the water.
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  #3  
Old 12-17-2009
daveblt daveblt is offline
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[quote=atreides;7829]I think that is too late. Since I think that your rotation and pull should be nearly simultaneous, you can begin to breathe as you begin to pull.


I agree . You should think about and begin to breathe early in the stroke.



[quote= atreides;7829] I'm probably mid-pull when I take a breath but my head doesn't go back in until my arm is in mid recovery.


I usually stay with the inhale until my recovery arm is about to enter the water.


Dave
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Old 12-17-2009
inca inca is offline
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Seeing your replies, I guess I must still be doing something wrong because if I try to breathe at the beginning of the pull I cannot possible inhale yet. The earliest I can even attempt that would be mid pull...and probably closer to the end of the pull. Anyone have any ideas why this would be happening?
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  #5  
Old 12-17-2009
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CoachJohnB CoachJohnB is offline
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Sounds like you are breathing too late on the times that you only get water. As mentioned in the previous posts, you should be breathing very early. In fact, you should breath earlier than YOU think you should.

You might try breathing as your recovering arm starts to enter the water. As the arms starts to enter the water, think about turning your head away from it(as in you don't want to see it going by your head on the way to your target position)

By the time you have reached your target, you should have had enough time to inhale and rotate the head back into the water.

You really don't want to see the other arm recovering past your face. It's almost like you are trying to hide the face from each arm.
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Old 12-17-2009
atreides atreides is offline
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Another thing that you might consider is your rotation. At my swim session today, i was experimenting with rotating-specificaly the timing of rotation. I would like to drive my hip a split second before I begin my pull. When I emphasized this I had a tendendency to over rotate. I found myself deeper in the water which required more time to rotate to the other side and get high enough to breathe. Could you be over rotating and finding that you are barely surfacing enough to get to air and sometimes not succeeding? When I go totally front quadrant, I find it hard to breathe before my pull because I want both hands in the water which means my head has to be down. Then I rotate and pull which means that I can only breathe after the stroke has begun. But I really don't have trouble getting air anymore. This is probably a bad habit but you might try riding your lead arm - that is almost going into a skate off of the pull and making sure you are high enough and are getting enough time to breathe. Then you better figure out rotation and timing of head movements. To do this you willl need to slow down the recovery on the side that you are breathing.
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Old 12-18-2009
inca inca is offline
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Originally Posted by CoachJohnB View Post
Sounds like you are breathing too late on the times that you only get water. As mentioned in the previous posts, you should be breathing very early. In fact, you should breath earlier than YOU think you should.

You might try breathing as your recovering arm starts to enter the water. As the arms starts to enter the water, think about turning your head away from it(as in you don't want to see it going by your head on the way to your target position)

By the time you have reached your target, you should have had enough time to inhale and rotate the head back into the water. .
I really am trying to breathe too late if this is when I should be breathing! I went back and looked at the TI video and many more TI videos posted online, and I may be wrong, but in each and every one it looks to me like the swimmer is inhaling at the *end* of the pull, just as the elbow/arm/hand is coming up out of the water and the head/face is not turned back into the water until the arm/hand is just starting to come back down into the water.
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Old 12-18-2009
BlueSpark BlueSpark is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inca View Post
I really am trying to breathe too late if this is when I should be breathing! I went back and looked at the TI video and many more TI videos posted online, and I may be wrong, but in each and every one it looks to me like the swimmer is inhaling at the *end* of the pull, just as the elbow/arm/hand is coming up out of the water and the head/face is not turned back into the water until the arm/hand is just starting to come back down into the water.
Inca, I too am rather surprised at the answers you received. I am having the same issue (that's why I'm here). One thing I don't "get" is how to breathe early in the pull. Isn't the pulling arm in the way? Am I understanding this right: I am supposed to rotate all the way to the breathing position and begin inhaling before my pulling arm is even halfway back to my hip? That seems odd. And my recollection of the DVD is the same as yours: the inhale comes at the end of the pull, perhaps even later than that.

What are we missing??

Blue
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  #9  
Old 12-18-2009
CoachKevin CoachKevin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inca View Post
I really am trying to breathe too late if this is when I should be breathing! I went back and looked at the TI video and many more TI videos posted online, and I may be wrong, but in each and every one it looks to me like the swimmer is inhaling at the *end* of the pull, just as the elbow/arm/hand is coming up out of the water and the head/face is not turned back into the water until the arm/hand is just starting to come back down into the water.
Yo, Inca, which TI video? Which part?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueSpark View Post
Inca, I too am rather surprised at the answers you received. I am having the same issue (that's why I'm here). One thing I don't "get" is how to breathe early in the pull. Isn't the pulling arm in the way? Am I understanding this right: I am supposed to rotate all the way to the breathing position and begin inhaling before my pulling arm is even halfway back to my hip? That seems odd. And my recollection of the DVD is the same as yours: the inhale comes at the end of the pull, perhaps even later than that. What are we missing?? Blue
Can you guys post a couple of links to the videos you're watching & some time stamps for reference?
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  #10  
Old 12-18-2009
Alex-SG Alex-SG is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inca View Post
Seeing your replies, I guess I must still be doing something wrong because if I try to breathe at the beginning of the pull I cannot possible inhale yet. The earliest I can even attempt that would be mid pull...and probably closer to the end of the pull. Anyone have any ideas why this would be happening?
Hello Inca,
I agree with Atreides and Dave: you may be turning your head too late.
Rather than thinking about when to inhale, I would suggest about thinking to rotate your head to the air faster.

Someone once wrote: "your chin should immediately follow the rising shoulder"
Remember that TI is about rotation... as soon as you start rotating your core, also start rotating the head.

So as soon as your recover hand gets into the water and extends to the target (X,Y) point, make sure you immediately rotate your head to air.
By the way that is the acceleration stage in your stroke (highest speed point) so the bowe wave created by your head helps you breath.

Hope this helps.

PS: By the way I assume that you are exhaling all the air in your lungs prior to inhaling. This was a problem I had to correct in the past, I would turn my head, exhale too late and then by the time I was ready to inhale again my recover hand was already at nose level (too late to breath).

Last edited by Alex-SG : 12-18-2009 at 07:14 PM.
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