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  #1  
Old 01-04-2013
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
Default Reducing 400m time from 7 to 6 minutes in 21 sessions

Here is a copy of the original post I made in Stroke ramp test stating my intentions.

I am going to test my ability to take a minute off my 400m time 2-3 seconds a time over 21 sessions by calculating precise SPL and TT settings.

I will perform 4x400m each time and in order to hit a time of only a 1 or 2 seconds shorter each session I have had to use different SPL and TT settings so this will also act as an extended ramp test fine tune?

The starting interval of 7:00 isn't my 400m fastest time, more like 1600m pace but since I am going to perform 4 repeats it feels a good place to start. I also want to get used to the template of the set with some easy wins at the top of the list.

by session 9 of 21 I will be hitting my current 400m race pace.

I will be using the TT for this as lane traffic will effect my time almost every swim as the pool is always busy after xmas, but with a precise SPL/TT target I will know if I am swimming at the right pace for the duration of the interval, even if I am delayed.

Here are my intervals. I am currently doing 2 interval sets a week, 2 distance and 1 extra technique/sprint time allowing. This will therefore be a 3 month goal approx.

No TT SPL Tim
1 1.29 20.33 00:07:00
2 1.35 19.33 00:06:58
3 1.24 21.00 00:06:57
4 1.23 21.00 00:06:53
5 1.20 21.33 00:06:50
6 1.23 20.66 00:06:47
7 1.20 21.00 00:06:43
8 1.23 20.33 00:06:40
9 1.24 20.00 00:06:37
10 1.23 20.00 00:06:34
11 1.20 20.33 00:06:30
12 1.17 20.66 00:06:27
13 1.20 20.00 00:06:24
14 1.14 20.67 00:06:17
15 1.17 20.00 00:06:14
16 1.14 20.33 00:06:11
17 1.08 21.33 00:06:09
18 1.11 20.67 00:06:07
19 1.14 20.00 00:06:05
20 1.08 21.00 00:06:03
21 1.11 20.33 00:06:01

I will publish my results as I go, it will be interesting to see what happens as I approach my 2012 400m time?

Any feedback on this approach welcome. Thanks.
Also 4 weeks to the annual florida trip which means video update 3 from me.
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  #2  
Old 01-04-2013
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
Default Session 1

Session 1 Thursday 3 January
Lane conditions 25m, double width 4 other slower swimmers in lane.
Pre swim preparation - busy day - bad sugary food.

Swim Target 4x400m 7.00 minutes TT1.29 SPL20.33(with turns)

1. 7.05 I dropped a couple of strokes in the middle and lost time on push offs
2. 7.04 As above

Instead of sticking to the task I then started to panic that I was struggling with a time that I thought would be an easy start and spent the rest of the session doing some 100s and 200s with different tempo settings but not swimming well at all.

Learnings for next session:-

1. Prepare mentally for the session with 4x25 superman glide and then 4x50 long stroke relaxed tune up.

2. Stick to the task. Its not the 7.00 time that's important its completing the task. It would have been much better to complete the 4x400m even though I was dropping a few strokes than to panic and start mixing things up.

I am clearly out of practice at swimming precise lengths with the TT.

3. Eat properly before swimming.

I will call this a false start and begin again tomorrow.
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  #3  
Old 01-04-2013
grandall grandall is offline
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Default

Hi Andy,

Always a treat to read your post's!

Was wondering in your pursuit of time shaving by practing 4 X 400m why 400?..why not 8 x 200?..Is there an increaed benifit in your training preperation in doing 400's vs 200's.
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What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
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  #4  
Old 01-04-2013
CoachSuzanne CoachSuzanne is offline
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Andy, thanks for sharing! Great learning opportunities. I agree with your comment of "sticking to your plan" and not bailing because of a few added strokes. you should at least have a pre-defined plan of what you'll do if the session does not match what you have planned. AFter all it would be a rare swim or training session where everything goes 100% as planned. That would actually be no fun and no challenge and each of us would be capable of becoming Olympic athlets and racing others of any age. Except since all of us would be able to do it, times would get faster and faster until we wouldn't need to swim anymore. Whomever has the fastest math equation would win (Fastest at creating the math equation, not whose equation resulted int he fastest time, although that too).

Also to consdier if one session doesn't go as planned will you repeat that session, move to the next session or do a hybrid of 1 & 2?

Some possibilities
if during yoru 4 x 400 you are dropping strokes and not meeting the session goal
- switch to 200s with rest and see if you can meet the session
YES? Then finish the swim and on the subsequent swim, repeat at least half of the current session...ie create a hybrid of sessions 1 (current) & 2 (next)
NO? Repeat session one with 8 x 200 but the same parameters, adn consdier completion of it doing double duty of neural programming as well as the conditioning needed to meet the programmming task.
THEN...For the next session do the hybrid if 1& 2

If the session went perfectly, then do the subsequent session as planned.

if you've done a hybrid session successfully, then the next session should be the subsequent FULL session of 400s.


Could you ever speed up the progression ? If you do hybrid of 1&2 and the session of 2s goes well in the hybrid, the following pool session could either be a session 2 & 3 hybrid or a full session 3.

In this way your planned 21 sessions would be considered a minimum, unless you also gave youself mperionssion to follow a hybrid 2 & 3 for example with a session 4 if all of the hybrid 3 went well.

Fun stuff.
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  #5  
Old 01-04-2013
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
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George,

I think 400 pace is much easier to translate to mile pace which is my racing distance.

Suzanne,

I laughed reading your post, its reminded me of reading genesis in the bible thirty odd years ago at junior school with everyone be-gating everyone else but I think I followed your point.

Tomorrow I will try a repeat of session 1 but with the same SPL and SR I was using earlier in the year TT1.22 and SBPL21.5. If I struggle with the 400's then I will fallback to 200's.

You are right, 21 will be the minimum number of sessions, but I hope once I am back on point with TT precision then I will make progress.

I also had my first session on a turbo trainer today, that was great fun if a little unusual.
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  #6  
Old 01-05-2013
craig.arnold@gmail.com craig.arnold@gmail.com is offline
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It's a great experiment Andy and I hope you are successful.

But of course we all have some pretty hard limits that we will run into at some point.
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  #7  
Old 01-05-2013
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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andyinnorway
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Much better, focus, food planning and performance today I was able to do two sets once the pool emptied out a bit

2x400m target time 7.00

1. TT1.22 SPL18 time 7.00

2. TT1.22 drafted a faster swimmer the whole way 6.33

I'm happy to call this a pass for session 1 so on to session 2 @ target time 6.57 next week.
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  #8  
Old 01-06-2013
CoachSuzanne CoachSuzanne is offline
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Andy I was reviewing your combos of SPL & Tempo and will be interested to hear how you fare on the days when tempo slows but SPL goes lower as that will be a different recruitment of muscle combinations to achieve a faster speed (as compared to a faster tempo and slightly higher SPL)

please keep us updated.
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Steel City Endurance, LTD
Fresh Freestyle

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  #9  
Old 02-13-2013
galax galax is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2009
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galax
Default The same for me, I have a dream: swim 400m under 6'00!!

My pb on 400m is 6'18".( 2 years ago).
It' was a good race for me, my stroke rate was the maximum rate that I could maintain.

Now I would like to reach 6'00, I know, it won't be easy, I'm 48y
Actually I'm not fit as 2 years ago but I hope to reach a good condition in 2 or 3 months.

Yesterday I made a test, with TT=1.20
400m in 7'01"
200m in 3'25"
100m in 1'40"

My swimming ability must improve because actually I need to set TT under 1.0 for swim 100m under 1'30".
A friend told me: "you can gain 20" on 400m but you must gain confidence at higher stroke rate"
Personally I think the table plan is not good for me: the frequence is too low.
The stroke ramp you show is very, very demanding for me.

Last edited by galax : 02-13-2013 at 10:04 AM.
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