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  #41  
Old 08-31-2011
RobM77 RobM77 is offline
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Ah, I understand now. I think our timing is completely different. I start the catch when my recovering hand (the one in the air), passes the "trigger point", which is the elbow of the spearing hand. As the recovering hand touches the water, the spearing hand bends at the elbow, and then as I spear forward with the recovering hand, the bent arm pulls back, and I simultaneously twist my body. The breathing is in sync with the recovering hand, so whenever that's the air my mouth is.

Last edited by RobM77 : 08-31-2011 at 03:25 PM.
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  #42  
Old 08-31-2011
lemur lemur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobM77 View Post
Ah, I understand now. I think our timing is completely different. I start the catch when my recovering hand (the one in the air), passes the "trigger point", which is the elbow of the spearing hand. As the recovering hand touches the water, the spearing hand bends at the elbow, and then as I spear forward with the recovering hand, the bent arm pulls back, and I simultaneously twist my body. The breathing is in sync with the recovering hand, so whenever that's the air my mouth is.
In anycase, we both found a solution to our breathing problems, and that's a great thing. :) Happy swimming, Rob!

Last edited by lemur : 08-31-2011 at 03:41 PM.
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  #43  
Old 08-31-2011
Zoner Zoner is offline
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I'm a new swimmer also. I had the same problem for 5 or so months. I know only what solved my problem. Better balance in the water and finding the best and most rythym when breathing. I can't imagine inhaling too much air. I never experienced that. But the one thing that has allowed me to keep swimming is getting all the air out before inhaling. So I immediately allow air out of my mouth as soon as my face hits the water. I never stop that but I add a full exhalation through my nose too as I'm turning to my next inhalation. So much that I can feel/see little squirts of water as I hit the surface. I breathe only to my left so sometimes I go 4 strokes and sometimes just 2. I'm now working on bilateral breathing. No way is endurance an issue that some coaches have pointed to. You can't run and bike for miles and then not be able to swim 10 minutes straight in a pool. Maybe in open water it gets a little trickier with waves and so forth. Nothing is more frustrating to hear someone say its endurance when the next guy is swimming up and down the lane yet that same person is huffing and puffing walking up one flight of stairs. I totally agree that being relaxed is huge. I ended up going to the pool just to get into the water and having it be a more natural thing. All the posts have their own points and you'll find the ones that'll help you the most given time.
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  #44  
Old 10-31-2011
jenson1a jenson1a is offline
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Default getting out of breath, still

I hope that Coach Suzanne]will be looking at this, I have a question that deals with a post by madvet on 6-25-2010 in response to suggestions for more relaxed breathing.

Madvet lists 3 points to aid in relaxed breathing. His 3rd point says that one shouldn't inhale when the arms are actively pulling. His reason for this is that one can't open the chest while the back and chest muscles are working so close to the chest.

Is there some truth to this? it seems that if you breathe as soon as your fingertips hit the water and then have your chin follow your shoulder to breathe, you would have already begun the pull.

I/m assuming you are a medical doctor and would have the best knowledge of the anatomy.

Sherry
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  #45  
Old 11-28-2011
bsekhon bsekhon is offline
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Default Getting out of breath

I am going through the same problem, I run, bike and work out but get out of breath after 50 meters of swimming. I agree that its not a fitness issue but its has either not exhaling enough or inhaling at the wrong time of the stroke.I have tried different breathing patterns but no success yet. I will try some of the tricks mentioned here today and see what works for me.
Its very frustrating though...I will try to inhale when my recovering arm passes my shoulder and stop as its back in water.Let you know how it goes.
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  #46  
Old 11-29-2011
CoachDeniseUllrich CoachDeniseUllrich is offline
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A few pointers, some you have already heard.
1. Put the emphasis on blowing out rather than taking in deep breaths to avoid the CO2 overload.
2. Practice slowly to coordinate movements and perfect form and balance .Slipping through the water requires less energy= more relaxed breathing. Release all excess tension in the joints and muscles.
3. Go slowly so you only need to breath every 3rd or more strokes. Pick up pace after everything is calm and graceful and you are not struggling to breath. This will help teach breath control. Use sweet spot breathing if you need to.
3. Make sure legs are quiet. Excessive kicking uses a lot of energy. Perfect the 2 beat kick.
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  #47  
Old 11-29-2011
efdoucette efdoucette is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachDeniseUllrich View Post
A few pointers, some you have already heard.
2. Practice slowly to coordinate movements and perfect form and balance .Slipping through the water requires less energy= more relaxed breathing. Release all excess tension in the joints and muscles.
This is a great thread, I'm picking up a lot of pointers that I take to the pool. My breathing is coming along and I can now swim 50 meters before a rest, swimming more relaxed, keeping my head down. The theory that I'm currently struggling with: how to keep joints and muscles relaxed but at the same time keeping a long body with reach from toe to wrist and engaged core. Seems like a contradiction for my pea brain, can anyone clarify, thank you.
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  #48  
Old 11-29-2011
CoachDeniseUllrich CoachDeniseUllrich is offline
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A couple of ideas:
1.Work outside of the pool on flexibility and massage. Key in on areas where you carry tension and focus on releasing those.
2.Drill purposefully, focusing on those areas until they are relaxed.
3.Check to make sure you are opening joints rather than reaching for your elongation. It is a much more subtle and relaxed movement. Especially focus on opening the axilla( armpit) muscle.
4.Always focus on being quiet and slippery and graceful through the water,remembering the quiet legs.
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  #49  
Old 11-29-2011
Scotty Scotty is offline
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Edalban:

I have never heard of anyone initiate breathing in the "fully extended position" after the pull has ended. The conventional wisdom (though perhaps not TI's conventional wisdom) is that the chin follows the pulling arm.

I'm not discounting your approach though. For me that represents my highest point of rotation and my mouth will be nearest the air. You are correct, however, that breathing in this position will test your balance. In my current breathing technique both arms are close to being in the front quadrant and that certainly helps stability.

I'm now drilling quite a bit using a one-armed pull and my breath comes a lot later than when I am using two arms. It's tough to tell from videos where most swimmers initiate the inhale.

Does anyone else in the forum have success with breathing after the pull is complete?

Scotty
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  #50  
Old 11-29-2011
Mike from NS Mike from NS is offline
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I've just re-read this entire thread ... still searching for the magic of easy breathing.

There was no mention of the swim & nod drill. I've been practicing this more frequently lately; and it has helped. The drill suggests to increasingly turn the head and observe different things without breathing over maybe 3 nods to the side. Observe the lane line, the water-air interface, and even the bow wave the head creates. I really didn't think I had enough speed to form a bow wave - but as Suzanne pointed out somewhere - we don't need speed to develop a bow wave. I'm not sure is seeing one's bow wave is a breakthrough or not -- but I did see my bow wave --- (it was a moment of amazement). Also not enough has been said how essential balance is to breathing. Maintaining a patient lead hand has helped me breathe more easily to my weaker side with about the same ease as my good side. But I think balance was the key here as well. Another aspect that is working well is keeping the head low. Fighting lifting the head is necessary as lifting destroys any balance. It has been amazing how easy it can be to get that bite when the head is kept low. One thing that hindered my breathing was over rotation. When over-rotated to almost "stacked" shoulders you will find that sinking "feeling" is more than a feeling as your head gets farther away from the air. With the swim & nod drill we learn to not lift the head, rotate just enough and then turn the head just a bit more to the air while we keep "one goggle wet". It is closer than we think ! But the basis for any magic, in my mind is balance with a low head.

Mike
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