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  #1  
Old 06-04-2016
Zenturtle Zenturtle is offline
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Zenturtle
Default Slow and fast posture

I have experienced this before in backstroke, but last night it seemd to work in freestyle the same way; the optimal posture for slow swimming getting optimal balance is different to the posture for faster swimming.
In backstroke making a curved upperback helps getting the legs up, in freestyle its bending the upperback the other way around, pressing the buoy deeper in the water.
When going faster getting in a more normal, straight line, giving up some of this slow swim slightly exagerated bended posture proves more effective.
Little less drag, and better through body connection.
I guess the transition point is very personal and dependant of your natural balance.
People with floating legs possibly never have to lean on their buoy, and others with sinky legs always have to keep that pressure at any speed to keep the legs up.
My transition lies between 60 sec /50 m as slow and 40 sec/50 m as fast posture in this regard. Thats from a horizontal floater.
Anyone had simular experience?
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Old 06-04-2016
descending descending is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenturtle View Post
I have experienced this before in backstroke, but last night it seemd to work in freestyle the same way; the optimal posture for slow swimming getting optimal balance is different to the posture for faster swimming.
In backstroke making a curved upperback helps getting the legs up, in freestyle its bending the upperback the other way around, pressing the buoy deeper in the water.
When going faster getting in a more normal, straight line, giving up some of this slow swim slightly exagerated bended posture proves more effective.
Little less drag, and better through body connection.
I guess the transition point is very personal and dependant of your natural balance.
People with floating legs possibly never have to lean on their buoy, and others with sinky legs always have to keep that pressure at any speed to keep the legs up.
My transition lies between 60 sec /50 m as slow and 40 sec/50 m as fast posture in this regard. Thats from a horizontal floater.
Anyone had simular experience?
I think when you get to a certain fitness level this will change for you it just stays 'on' in the same capacity no matter the workload. Now I'm not saying there isn't some stuff going on at say 1:10 that isn't going on at 1:30, but in my head my body lines and tension are the same. Surely with the effort level going up there are other things I can't articulate adding to that posture. I can say for sure my core tension goes up b/c my rotations are speeding up. When I push off the wall during warm up and lock in my body position b/f the first stroke it's the same process from warm up to main set, but I agree there are certainly some things going on in there I can't quite explain. As stroke rate and kick rate go up the muscles are spending less time at rest and more time at work from head to toe. I think this is where stroke timing can really impact as well. When my recovery finger tips just touch the water out front my catch has transitioned to pull and my elbow is at mid torso compared to a delayed motion with the arm out front more in the catch up mode. Big dif in tension.

This video clip of Total Immersion Swim Coach Karin you put up a few weeks ago has some great underwater of that timing I use right at 39-40 seconds:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBKaxS5VAhA

I'm heading to swim practice in a bit and will make sure I pay attention to these aspects during warm up.

Last edited by descending : 06-04-2016 at 12:54 PM.
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  #3  
Old 06-04-2016
Zenturtle Zenturtle is offline
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yeah the stroke timing micht have something to do with it.
My shoulders like a catchup stroke more than a fast catch stroke where one arm is already catching when the other comes over.
That transition point causes shoulder tension. That what it makes it more difficult to feel the balance effects in freestyle, where its easier in backstroke.
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Old 06-04-2016
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I have been watching a lot of her video this morning here is another one of her at about 40 seconds with more of the timing I use. I think this is what puts a little more tension in my body line vs a lot of catch up. Is this the action that bothers your shoulder on recovery or is it the catching arm?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh_dz45aT3I
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  #5  
Old 06-04-2016
Zenturtle Zenturtle is offline
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Its more the lifting of the other arm when the other is in catch position.
The lifting requires extra effort than, probably caused by shoulder stiffness.
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Old 06-04-2016
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Well you have to be careful with that for sure no sense tempting it if you sense it's the bad kind of feedback. Keep the shoulders healthy. I think something you might want ot really focus on if you are not already is make sure the focus of your stroke is coming from driving your rotations completely. That doesn't mean 90 degrees, but enough for you. Make the hips/core the motor. I think the more you do that the less you will feel positional/balance changes at different speeds. The rotations at faster speeds are typically going to be less in terms of degress b/c of the time compressed nature.

Last edited by descending : 06-04-2016 at 03:00 PM.
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  #7  
Old 06-05-2016
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Oddly Zen I don't think she is a TI coach any longer I was looking into the channel of the youtube owner of that video and it looks like they are training her to be a coach.

http://www.feelforthewater.com/2016/...-swimmers.html
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  #8  
Old 06-06-2016
Zenturtle Zenturtle is offline
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Some woman shop for shoes, others for swim learning methods.
Must say never found that TI looked very good on her. Always the competetive urge shined through.
Her 2Bk lookes a bit wobbly in her swimger style at the moment, but she will sort that out probably.
Her standard competetive stroke looks near perfect in my eyes.
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  #9  
Old 06-06-2016
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As long as she's getting what she needs that's all that matters. Swimming is about fun after all do what 'floats your boat'! Hey I've enjoyed chatting with you all, but I will bid you adieu as I've digested enough material here to satiate my interests and have spent way too much time online. Scary how fast a web forum can swallow you up it's been like binge tv watching! Safe swimming all.
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  #10  
Old 06-06-2016
Zenturtle Zenturtle is offline
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It has been a pleasure chatting with you, but it must be like a group discussing the best method to walk for you.
Should my middle toe leave the ground first, how much pressure on the big toe, and do the hips lead the knee or the foot the ankle?

My own stroke is converting to a certain style by now and I know pretty sure when its moving in the right or in the wrong direction.
Somewhere in the middle between smooth and swingerstyle, with a half straight recovery.
So in that sense I dont get much out swimforums anymore, but there are worse manners to kill some time.
Anyway, wishing you many good swims.!
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