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  #1  
Old 08-25-2014
SlipryNoodle SlipryNoodle is offline
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SlipryNoodle
Default Day Two Workshop Blues

I see more drills in my future. Before making arrangements to have some pool time with Coach Mandy (who is really helpful, btw) I was thinking of picking up the training plans. Will they contain the same drills as what I saw in the modern day workshop? Enough focal points to drill for 25 miles vs 25 yds?

Thanks for the help. Someday I'll get this...

Last edited by SlipryNoodle : 08-25-2014 at 05:49 AM.
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  #2  
Old 08-25-2014
MTBROAD MTBROAD is offline
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MTBROAD
Default Target Student???

Sounds like it was a great class.

How would you describe the class with regard to the "target" student - is this class for someone who is completely new to TI, completely new to swimming, or for a swimmer has figured out much of the TI basics and is trying to fine tune their skills?
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  #3  
Old 08-25-2014
SlipryNoodle SlipryNoodle is offline
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Boy, that really depends on the student, and I can't quite tell you yet because I was really set on what I think is a work in process.

It is my observation at the end of the 2 days that the folks who got the most visible and immediate results were already doing masters classes and tris. I think for them, the drills set up a biomechanic shift in their stroke, and it was easy for them to make the connection. Out of a class of maybe 35 people, 7 or so of us broke out of the main group to get more drill work, rather than chugging out the laps that the bulk of the class did. This was necessary, as I think all of us still had balance issues to wrestle with. I also think we were the least experienced 'swimmers' in the group. It made sense that we needed more time.

Now, none of my videotaped sessions went well for me. In fact, I think my final taping was my worst of the weekend (though I haven't seen it yet.) I was throwing in a breath stroke, where I had only just started to drill successfully with it, and that success wasn't natural yet. Took water on my first stroke of the video and it was the hardest 25 yds, followed quickly by the same issue for the subsequent 25 yds.

Am I a worse swimmer, or did I have some bad laps? Well, I don't know yet. I do know that I have a much greater awareness of what my body should do. I really feel that my arms are in the right position, in say a skate drill. I raise my head. I'm not patient with my arms. My breath strokes have a focal point that I just started to understand. SO, I know what to correct, but my body needs to develop what my brain wants. I see the path, so to speak. I *believe* that while I wrestle with these fundamental issues, I won't be very strong at swimming, but given a short period of time, I'll be much further ahead.

I also *believe* that I would have never gotten here without the workshop. At the end of day 1, I was fired up. Lasted right until I saw my end of day video first thing Sunday morning. My mind didn't match reality.

I'll tell you what though, some of those skate and switch sessions...boy, I think I could have gone the entire 25 yards without needing a breath. Very relaxing. Some of the focal points, when I could just turn off brain telling me to "keep your head down and be patient with the arms" were amazing too.

Long response for what could easily be summed up in the sentence "Ask me again in a couple months if it was a good class or not." ;) I know I still couldn't swim 200 yds non-stop, so I was disappointed, but there is a bigger picture to remember.

Hope this helps.

Last edited by SlipryNoodle : 08-25-2014 at 06:17 PM.
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  #4  
Old 08-25-2014
SlipryNoodle SlipryNoodle is offline
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Sorry, in all of that, I didn't answer your question.

Target: might be good to understand the drills from a recent video, but probably not necessary.

I have played with TI drills. I think the bulk of the class had as well. I don't think it was necessary because everybody starts in Superman on day 1, regardless of what you might have studied prior.

The bigger question is, if you are familiar with the TI drills already, are you absolutely certain that you are doing them correctly?? If you say no, or you are uncertain, well, the workshop is good.
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  #5  
Old 08-25-2014
Rincewind Rincewind is offline
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Well, I think you need to have realistic expectations. I've never done a workshop or met with any coach face to face. But I have definitely learned a lot from this forum and by following up on articles suggested here and other swimming forums. Maybe some people can drastically become better overnight, but the main benefit is gaining awareness of where you can improve and how. For me the change was very slow and gradual.
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  #6  
Old 08-25-2014
SlipryNoodle SlipryNoodle is offline
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Agree that my expectations were on the aggressive side. Others may be able to learn from that though...and I am encouraged by a better sense of body awareness within the water. This should help future efforts greatly.
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  #7  
Old 08-25-2014
CharlesCouturier CharlesCouturier is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlipryNoodle View Post
Boy, that really depends on the student, and I can't quite tell you yet because I was really set on what I think is a work in process.

It is my observation at the end of the 2 days that the folks who got the most visible and immediate results were already doing masters classes and tris. I think for them, the drills set up a biomechanic shift in their stroke, and it was easy for them to make the connection. Out of a class of maybe 35 people, 7 or so of us broke out of the main group to get more drill work, rather than chugging out the laps that the bulk of the class did. This was necessary, as I think all of us still had balance issues to wrestle with. I also think we were the least experienced 'swimmers' in the group. It made sense that we needed more time.

Now, none of my videotaped sessions went well for me. In fact, I think my final taping was my worst of the weekend (though I haven't seen it yet.) I was throwing in a breath stroke, where I had only just started to drill successfully with it, and that success wasn't natural yet. Took water on my first stroke of the video and it was the hardest 25 yds, followed quickly by the same issue for the subsequent 25 yds.

Am I a worse swimmer, or did I have some bad laps? Well, I don't know yet. I do know that I have a much greater awareness of what my body should do. I really feel that my arms are in the right position, in say a skate drill. I raise my head. I'm not patient with my arms. My breath strokes have a focal point that I just started to understand. SO, I know what to correct, but my body needs to develop what my brain wants. I see the path, so to speak. I *believe* that while I wrestle with these fundamental issues, I won't be very strong at swimming, but given a short period of time, I'll be much further ahead.

I also *believe* that I would have never gotten here without the workshop. At the end of day 1, I was fired up. Lasted right until I saw my end of day video first thing Sunday morning. My mind didn't match reality.

I'll tell you what though, some of those skate and switch sessions...boy, I think I could have gone the entire 25 yards without needing a breath. Very relaxing. Some of the focal points, when I could just turn off brain telling me to "keep your head down and be patient with the arms" were amazing too.

Long response for what could easily be summed up in the sentence "Ask me again in a couple months if it was a good class or not." ;) I know I still couldn't swim 200 yds non-stop, so I was disappointed, but there is a bigger picture to remember.

Hope this helps.
First, congratulations for your decision to take this sort of action in order to improve your swimming. I won't be able to contribute much to your discussion as I'm not a TI coach. However, I've thought a lot about the issue which you are raising and wanted to simply share with TI coaches what my own solution to this is.

Reason why I'm interested into this is that as a coach, I can't live with the idea that someone could have possibly lost his/her time coming to one of my seminar/class/camp. Therefore I decided to always create a follow up thread on my forum for allowing participant to pursue with their process.

The equivalent here on TI would be this forum on favorite practice/sets/etc. Why not emailing your TI coach and see with him/her if it's possible to post a few key sessions here on TI Forums? Whilst most TI coaches don't seem to be contributing on here on a regular basis, I'd venture stating that a) most have a valid login and b) most would be keen to contribute on demand.
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  #8  
Old 08-25-2014
SlipryNoodle SlipryNoodle is offline
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SlipryNoodle
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I think that feedback will be available, and I may have jumped the gun on posting this thread. In fact, had I seen the delete option, I would have deleted this post before the discussion started.

I'm certainly happy that I took the workshop, and I don't want to give the opposite impression.
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  #9  
Old 08-25-2014
Rincewind Rincewind is offline
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Rincewind
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No, I think you were right in posting it. It can only help TI to improve their workshops.

I am sure TI wants everybody to leave the workshop with the feeling that it was time well spent. If in your case you had some doubts then its something they can work on to make the overall experience even better.
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  #10  
Old 08-25-2014
Scotty Scotty is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Kansas
Posts: 83
Scotty
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Noodle dude:

Don't be disappointed in your video performance at the weekend training or the fact that your expectations were not met.

I thoroughly enjoyed my TI weekend and could not wait to jump in the water Monday morning and show off my newly developed streamlined swimming to all my pool colleagues. Needless to say, I was devastated to have my worst swim ever that day.

After some time to reflect I attribute this dramatic regression to all the new information in my head that had not been processed yet to my body. Patient hand, powerful hip drive, smooth hand entry, nodding to breathe, and early vertical forearm were like visions of sugar plums dancing in my head. (Apologies to Clement Clarke Moore).

But simultaneous execution was impossible and I floundered and struggled and got frustrated and tense. I took a week off and then focused on a single drill and interspersed that drill with whole stroke. Eventually the integration came, and my stroke became less clumsy.

It's been about five years since that weekend with Coach Hap Gentry, and I still face the same frustration every time I try to go to a new level. This month I had my daughter video some laps and I found out that my modest scissors kick had become wicked, and now extended the width of the lane marker.

In my attempt to gain more power, the recovery arm was way up in the air, hand leading the way and entering about six inches in front of my head. So I went back to the hand entry drills to make a correction. Swimming habits are hard to break and the entry still is not as smooth as I want. Now my timing is off.

The point of this post is that learning the right technique is often awkward difficult and time consuming. And learning a new skill often throws off some other element of the stroke. So congrats on completing the TI workshop and welcome to the maddening journey of success, setbacks, constant learning and hopefully continuous improvement.

Scotty
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