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  #21  
Old 11-02-2012
Grant Grant is offline
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Go for it Charles.
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  #22  
Old 11-02-2012
CharlesCouturier CharlesCouturier is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terry View Post
Charles, you may not BE a TI Coach, but you clearly THINK like one--(which means not like mainstream coaches.) I hope you're giving thought to pursuing TI Certification. You so clearly belong. And we need someone in Canada with your professional qualifications.

Am I the only one who else thinks Charles should become a TI Coach?
Who knows....

In the mean time though I humbly believe that the heart of TI is still well outside my scope. Count on me to never pretend being what I'm not, ie well position to teach your material.

That doesn't mean I won't sometimes teach some of your values, I just do it my way though LOL

I was pleased to hear earlier that I'm back on FINA OW World circuit next summer, with a swimmer that's not meant to score a podium to say the least. We feel blessed to be given a try, and aiming at not finishing last.

First things first, I prescribed him 50k of ankle band drill (no pull) just because I'm not happy with his balance. He's not allowed to remove the band until he finishes the 50k.

Then the 2bk, which he didn't even know that this meant 3 months ago LOL

But you guys rock, I'm having a good time here, not ashamed to admit. And I am flattered that some may feel the same.
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  #23  
Old 11-02-2012
CharlesCouturier CharlesCouturier is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WFEGb View Post
Thanks again and another question. How to get the SPL/DPS window as small as yours?
Ah, now you've reached my limit!! lol

I'm convinced that Coach Sue has some theories on this though, she entertained me the other evening on that.

Your question raises another question. Can the delta between lowest and highest dps be an indicator of the stability of the stroke?

If so. Then can we assume that higher delta may mean that the flaws in the stroke have bigger impact, for instance on balance, or streamlining, than the flaws you'd expect to find in a stroke that has smaller delta?

For example. When I get tired, I probably break frontal axis a bit, loose balance a bit, certainly loose some of the ability to pull high elbow. That accounts for my biggest/smallest dps delta.

I'd expect that someone that starts popping the head out to breathe in, as soon as fatigue kicks in, to suffer from a bigger drop DPS, since this will severely alter balance.

If this be true, then Terry was right to say that I was wrong in giving you the feedback I gave you, although this feedback remains true in my own personal case.

Last edited by CharlesCouturier : 11-02-2012 at 02:33 AM.
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  #24  
Old 11-02-2012
andyinnorway andyinnorway is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlesCouturier View Post
Ah, now you've reached my limit!! lol

I'm convinced that Coach Sue has some theories on this though, she entertained me the other evening on that.

Your question raises another question. Can the delta between lowest and highest dps be an indicator of the stability of the stroke?

If so. Then can we assume that higher delta may mean that the flaws in the stroke have bigger impact, for instance on balance, or streamlining, than the flaws you'd expect to find in a stroke that has smaller delta?

For example. When I get tired, I probably break frontal axis a bit, loose balance a bit, certainly loose some of the ability to pull high elbow. That accounts for my biggest/smallest dps delta.

I'd expect that someone that starts popping the head out to breathe in, as soon as fatigue kicks in, to suffer from a bigger drop DPS, since this will severely alter balance.

If this be true, then Terry was right to say that I was wrong in giving you the feedback I gave you, although this feedback remains true in my own personal case.
Charles, you have answered the question anyway, the reason that DPS shifts less dramatically with an experienced swimmer is that the stroke flaws that creep in with fatigue are less critical.

I should be better at remembering this as it was only a few months ago my own DPS became more consistent over distance but I am a bit hazy.

I think it may have been that as I became tired I instinctively rotated further to breathe (to take a breather) which would then cause my opposite elbow to drop and I would lose good catch on that side. This is one element that could get progressively worse during a swim and so cause DPS to slip further and futher.
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  #25  
Old 11-02-2012
terry terry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlesCouturier View Post
First things first, I prescribed him 50k of ankle band drill (no pull) just because I'm not happy with his balance. He's not allowed to remove the band until he finishes the 50k.

Then the 2bk
Charles
First, congratulations on having your athlete qualify for that circuit. How does one qualify? By nation? Or among all potential swimmers worldwide?

Second, I agree you're on the right track in teaching him to adapt to 2BK, but think there's a better - and much faster - way.
I've had lots of personal experience with ankle band. The most useful thing I got from it was feeling catch better. Also helped encourage higher elbows. But it taught me little or nothing of the awareness or muscle activation that ultimately gave me a 2BK that has gradually become a powerful aid to race performance -- and feeling silky synchronicity.

When swimming with it, I could feel my legs straining against it. When I swam instead without it, but simply pressing my feet lightly together, I no longer felt my legs straining to pull apart. Instead I felt my spinal stabilizers really working.

Our teaching methodology now has our coaches lightly hold the student's ankles together (not supporting, but just pressing inward with an open hand) while they swim a short distance -- 8 to 10 strokes. Then reverse and have student hold the coach's ankles similarly. We ask the student to compare sensations. What forces do they feel their own legs exerting. What do they feel the coaches exerting.
A few minutes of that is often enough to break old habits and start new ones. It's part of a 3-step manually-assisted process that consistently gets formerly-busy kickers pretty well along to a far more economical, and reasonably well-timed 2BK.
But if I shared all three steps, I'd have to kill you ;-). Or send you a bill for training.
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  #26  
Old 11-02-2012
WFEGb WFEGb is offline
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Hi Terry,

Quote:
As well, Craig's instinct to stop his set or practice because he could sense he wasn't on an path to achieve the central goal to improve his swimming -- and then work through a logical decision tree (start with elements of balance) to solve the problem he sensed -- is what makes this thread such a quintessential example of the TI Method.

It's more about mindset than movement.
Is it impossible to get the right TI-mindset while in swimming movement even when getting tired? To me (as an uncertainly TIer) sometimes TI-mindset and movement seem to be just the same thing... but in my continues (for me longer) swims a gap sneaks in and increases imperceptibly at first... and at the last lap they seem to be two complete opposite things.

Regards,
Werner
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  #27  
Old 11-02-2012
WFEGb WFEGb is offline
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Hi Charles,

Quote:
Ah, now you've reached my limit!! lol
...which is probably beyond my capabilities...

Quote:
Your question raises another question. Can the delta between lowest and highest dps be an indicator of the stability of the stroke?
And your answer? I'd like to get that delta infinitesimal (which way?)... and then get the SPL down... and feel as good while swimming as I suspect Terry, Shinji and... do.

Emil Zatopek, an olypian long distance runner in former times said in an interview at his 80th (or 75th) birthday: I feel very good, because I can run as long as I like at the pace that I like... This goal is not so bad for swimming even in aged years I believe...

Regards,
Werner

PS: No.4 You should become a TI coach. You'ld be the first living coach in two swimming worlds, wouldn't it be interesting?

Last edited by WFEGb : 11-02-2012 at 07:00 PM. Reason: PS
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