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  #1  
Old 04-07-2017
bx bx is offline
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Default Counter-rotation & catch

I found the following from a Race Club article, about getting the catch as the body counter-rotates back the other way:-

http://theraceclub.com/aqua-notes/bo...tion-swimming/
[2nd para, a couple of lines down]
Quote:
When we enter our right hand in the water, for example, our body is rotating to the left. At the very moment we begin our catch, the body has stopped rotating left and initiates the counter-rotation back to the right. We call this point the connection (between arm and core/hips). This counter rotation creates a stabilizing force that gives us something to pull against.
I'm not sure if they have a typo here, as the right hand entering seems at odds with what they say next.

Anyway, I think I know what they mean, because I discovered it during single-arm freestyle. I will try to explain... In single-arm, I was frustrated at how I couldn't get any firmness on my catch. I discovered a neat trick, that if I spear onto my left track, and then sharply start rotating back to the right, my catch arm (left) immediately locks onto the water.

This only seems to be possible with a continuous flutter kick, as I need a kick to start the sharp counter-rotation.

Is this a neat trick, or the real thing for getting the catch? Thoughts etc welcome...
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Old 04-07-2017
Danny Danny is offline
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It seems to me that, if you are skating on your left side, your left arm can't develop a vertical forearm, because the anatomy of your shoulder joint won't let that happen. To attain that vertical forearm, you will need to start rotating back to the right side. Just how far you will have to go depends on how much flexibility your shoulder joint has, but when you have rotated far enough to the right so that your left forearm starts to become vertical, that will feel like you are getting a lock on the water. If you do this fast enough, it may feel like you get that lock as soon as you reverse directions, but, at least for me, I need to rotate enough to the right to allow this to happen.
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Old 04-09-2017
CoachBobM CoachBobM is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bx View Post
I found the following from a Race Club article, about getting the catch as the body counter-rotates back the other way:-

http://theraceclub.com/aqua-notes/bo...tion-swimming/
[2nd para, a couple of lines down]


I'm not sure if they have a typo here, as the right hand entering seems at odds with what they say next.
I'm not sure why you have a problem with what they say. Let's put it this way: Imagine that you are skating on your left side (i.e., with your left arm extended forward, belly button pointed to the right), that you have recovered your right arm and are about to pierce the water with it (mailslot entry). As your right hand is piercing the water, you begin to roll to your left (i.e., toward your skate position on the other side) and simultaneously begin to drop your left forearm (reaching over the hood of the VW beetle).


Bob
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Old 04-10-2017
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CoachStuartMcDougal CoachStuartMcDougal is offline
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Hi Danny,

That is odd and suspect it's a typo. When you enter right arm, you rotate to your right edge, not your left edge. But Gary Hall seems puzzled what actually rotates the body given the amount of confusing words he uses. The easiest, quickest way to rotate body is with the weight and momentum of recovery arm entering to forward extension combined with opposite side kick (down) - whole body coordination.

Stuart
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Old 04-10-2017
Tom Pamperin Tom Pamperin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachStuartMcDougal View Post
Hi Danny,

That is odd and suspect it's a typo. When you enter right arm, you rotate to your right edge, not your left edge. But Gary Hall seems puzzled what actually rotates the body given the amount of confusing words he uses. The easiest, quickest way to rotate body is with the weight and momentum of recovery arm entering to forward extension combined with opposite side kick (down) - whole body coordination.

Stuart
Coach Stuart,

I'm curious what you suggest to students about the optimal timing of the 2bk in relation to the rotation. I mostly kick just after hand entry, but seem solid enough in my control that I could adjust that timing some if that doesn't seem correct.

Thanks in advance (as always) for your insight!
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www.tompamperin.com
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Old 04-10-2017
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Hi Tom,

That's a good description, hand in (even up to elbow) before kick fires. But really is where the whole body is coordinated to fire together, energy flowing from fingertips to (opposite) toes through the core like a whip. Often, a swimmer will kick from knee too early and break that powerful kinetic chain disconnecting the core/hips.

Stuart
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Old 04-10-2017
Danny Danny is offline
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Stuart, Tom,

The question of when to kick is in some way addressed by Coach Boomer's video that you, Stuart, posted some time ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e24vIP-3b3w
In this video, the demonstrator Sam is not using a 2bk, but the message I take from this video is that the focus need not be on the kick specifically but rather on the entire body rotation. The kick, of course, is an integral part of this rotation, but, based on this, my answer to the question of when to kick would be "kick so that your entire body rotates with the spear up front". You can feel when all of this is one motion, and you can also detect split second differences just by feeling. Does this make sense?
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Old 04-10-2017
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Hey Danny,

Excellent video and description from Coach Boomer. Yes - Sam has a 6bk, but he has a clean connected rotational kick. Rotational kick timing happens naturally when high-side (recovery) arm is connected to pelvis, its weight and momentum being thrown forward. Kick timing is more consequential with whole body coordination from the pelvis.

Stuart
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Old 04-11-2017
fooboo fooboo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachStuartMcDougal View Post
Excellent video and description from Coach Boomer. Yes - Sam has a 6bk, but he has a clean connected rotational kick. Rotational kick timing happens naturally when high-side (recovery) arm is connected to pelvis, its weight and momentum being thrown forward. Kick timing is more consequential with whole body coordination from the pelvis.
This marvelous video is in fact work-in-progress. Shows recovery momentum
and connection to the hip rotation.

The same principle works with bent arm. 2bk is crucial, at least two kicks that
help recovery arm. Kick acts like a whip added to the throw. Then you jump
over an anchor. No arms or legs, it is whole body job.

I moved to before described and used a lot less energy to go. Balance is cru-
cial. Rotation? Almost 90 degrees, whatever coach thinks. Head position also.
It naturally hides with high shoulder position.

Best regards all.
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