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  #21  
Old 03-15-2016
CoachSuzanne CoachSuzanne is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terry View Post
I give Keith an A for effort, and happy to analyze his video, but I think there's an error of logic here.
>>There's a slight error in the math. You should add seven to the stroke count instead of subtracting it from the time.

In Terry's first 50, he had 30 strokes plus 7 beats during push off and turn.>>

I don't think one can calculate 'beats' during turn and push off since I wasn't responding to the beep of a Tempo Trainer during this set.
That's true except that you provided this suggestion for how to calculate tempo:

Quote:
Can you calculate our tempos?
Here's how. We allow 3 beeps on initial push off and 4 beeps between final stroke on one lap and first stroke on next, when turning.
To roughly calculate tempo subtract 7 seconds from time and divide that by # of strokes.
While still a rough calculation you're equating a tempo of 1 second / beep for your pushoff & turn, subtracting 7 seconds from the time to account for "3 beeps on pushoff and 4 beeps" on the turn.

Either way it's an estimation but I think it's fair to be fluent in both ways to estimate tempo (subtract seconds from the or add strokes to the count). Adding strokes to the count would seem to be a slightly more accurate way for TI swimmers who are accustomed to swimming with the tempo trainer, even when they aren't.
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  #22  
Old 03-15-2016
keithstone
 
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Thanks, Terry.

I don't think I had a logic error, but I may have misunderstood the initial message. You wrote: "We allow 3 beeps on initial push off and 4 beeps between final stroke on one lap and first stroke on next, when turning." It sounds like you were varying your push off and turn along with the Tempo Trainer setting. If you always had seven seconds for push-off and turn, your formula was correct. But if you always had seven "beeps" on the Tempo Trainer, my formula would work better. (At 1.6 seconds per stroke, 7 "beeps" would take over 11 seconds of the total lap time). My formula was just a simplified version of John Torhan's, which tried to account for the variation in push-off/turn time:
1) tempo = stroke-time/strokes
2) stroke-time = total time - push-off/turn time, so
3) tempo = (total time - push-off/turn time)/strokes
If push-off/turn is always 7 seconds, you can stop here. This is your formula. But if it's always 7 " beeps" on the Tempo Trainer, you have to keep going:

4) tempo = (total time - 7*tempo)/strokes --John's formula
5) tempo*strokes = total time - 7*tempo
6) tempo*strokes + 7*tempo = total time
7) tempo*(strokes + 7) = total time
8) tempo = total time/(strokes + 7) --my formula

Anyway, this was a fun exercise. I enjoy reading about your swim practice. I used to live in Poughkeepsie about 10 years ago, but I didn't swim back then. I wish I had known about TI when I lived nearby. I've learned a lot from your approach via Suzanne, and I adopt the mental elements to my running and biking, too. It has changed my approach to many aspects of life.

(I actually earned my tough-guy nickname, Keith Stone, as a result of TI. But that's a story for another day.)

Best wishes!

Quote:
Originally Posted by terry View Post
I give Keith an A for effort, and happy to analyze his video, but I think there's an error of logic here.
>>There's a slight error in the math. You should add seven to the stroke count instead of subtracting it from the time.

In Terry's first 50, he had 30 strokes plus 7 beats during push off and turn.>>

I don't think one can calculate 'beats' during turn and push off since I wasn't responding to the beep of a Tempo Trainer during this set.
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  #23  
Old 03-15-2016
terry terry is offline
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Keith
On that day I wasn't using a TT. Just counting strokes and taking time. Most accurate would be if I had someone watch me training a set like that and timed the interval between final hand-hit going into turn and first one coming out.
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My TI Story
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  #24  
Old 03-15-2016
terry terry is offline
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Default Gradually Raising Tempo

Tues 15 March 3200scm at Nassau County Aquatic Center
This pool offers both 25y and 25m courses, whenever it's not set up for 50m swimming. I always opt for scm on those days because it's a tiny bit more challenging and I like to cultivate a 'meters mindset.'

I did two sets today. one without Tempo Trainer and one with. But my goal on both was the same--to encode the ability to increase tempo (and speed) while maintaining consistent Stroke Length.

Set #1 Tuneup
3 rounds of 4 x 100 at 17 SPL as a 'cascading' descend. I.E. Descend each round. Make subsequent rounds a bit faster.
1-4 on 2:00 interval. This was wholly a tuneup, done entirely with a featherlight touch. I descended from 1:50 to 1:40 without trying at all to swim faster.
5-8 on 1:55 interval. I descended from 1:40 to 1:37.
9-12 on 1:50 interval. I descended from 1:39 to 1:36.

I did the last two rounds as follows:
1st 100 Hold, don't pull/push. Featherlight touch.
2nd 100 Apply light but precise pressure.
3rd 100 Add a conscious hip nudge.
4th 100 Add a conscious toe flick.

Set #2 Main Task
3 rounds of 3 x 200 at 18 SPL.
Round 1 at 1.09 Tempo. I averaged 3:09/200
Round 2 at 1.07 Tempo. I averaged 3:08
Round 3 at 1.05 Tempo. I averaged 3:06.

It took noticeably more effort to hold 18SPL for 200m at 1.05. I was pretty close to my 'neural threshold' there.
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May your laps be as happy as mine.

My TI Story
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  #25  
Old 03-18-2016
s.sciame s.sciame is offline
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Terry, I read your amazing blog post, congratulations!!

Salvo
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  #26  
Old 03-29-2016
terry terry is offline
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Default Returning to Practice

I was away from the pool for nearly two weeks. I severely burned my right hand in a cooking mishap on Mar 12, the morning of the 1650 race in which I broke the Adirondack 60-64 record. Though the burn was quite painful I thought immersion cool water would be good for it. My hand hurt the first few lengths of the race, but I never noticed it after that.
On Wed the 16th I had my doctor look at it and he said I shouldn't swim until it healed. Otherwise I risked both infection and not healing properly, with the possibility of some loss of mobility in my thumb, which was part of the burned area.
Today was my first practice since Tues Mar 15. I swam fairly cautiously, not wanting to overdo. My whole practice was 100m repeats in a 50m pool.

Monday 28 Mar 3000m at Nassau County Aquatic Center
Tuneup
6 x 100 on 2:00
My first 100 was 1:57 and 79 strokes. I think that's the slowest 100m repeat I've swum in 50 years. But I took only 3 seconds rest and started on the 2nd.
That was 1:57 also, but one less stroke.
By the time I reached #6 I'd improved to 1:53 and 77 strokes. I was pleased with that and decided I was ready to begin a more exacting task.

Set #2 Swim 10 x 100 on 2:00 Tempo Pyramid
I started with Tempo at 1.2. I took 81 strokes on the 1st 100 and my time was 1:46.
I slowed tempo by .04 each 100 for the first 4 x 100. Total strokes dropped to 75 and time was 1:48.
Then I increased tempo by .02 for next 6 x 100. Finished the set (at 1.2 tempo) at 78 strokes and 1:43.

Set #3 Swim 14 x 100 1-6 on 2:05; 7-14 on 2:10. Tempo Pyramid
On this set I slowed tempo by .02 for 5 x 100 and increased by .01 for 7 x 100.
This time I improved to 77 strokes and a time of 1:41 at 1.20 tempo.

After completing this practice I went home and completed my entry for USMS Masters Nationals Apr 28 to May 1 in Greensboro NC.
I entered 100, 200, 500, 1000 and 1650 free.
Both 1000 and 1650 are on the same day.
I'll only swim one of them, most likely the 1650.
I'm excited already.
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Terry Laughlin
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May your laps be as happy as mine.

My TI Story

Last edited by terry : 03-29-2016 at 11:13 AM.
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  #27  
Old 03-30-2016
s.sciame s.sciame is offline
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Hi Terry, you gave a beautiful description of the perfect race in your blog. A flow state experience. More in detail, what made the difference mostly, what made you 35s faster than planned? You focused on doing everything right, ok, every stroke, every turn, every breath.
I assume you planned and counted SPL: did you always match your planned count? Or took fewer strokes than expected?
Stroke rate: do you think you stroked at a higher than planned rate?
Pacing: even, negative splits?
What was your breathing pattern?
Turns: did you turn better than usually?

I'm sure you analyzed all these details, congrats again!

Salvo
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  #28  
Old 03-31-2016
terry terry is offline
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Sal
These are great questions. In fact your questions and the answers to them probably give me enough material for another blog.

SPL: did you match your planned count? Or took fewer strokes than expected?
I had planned to swim 500 or so at 16 SPL, 800 or so at 17 and the final 250 or so at 17. When I make such a plan, I anticipate I won't do it exactly that way. I always want to feel the stroke count is right--allowing me to maintain or increase pace, to go into each turn strongly, and minimize effort and fatigue.
I was pretty close to that plan.

Stroke rate: do you think you stroked at a higher than planned rate?
I didn't plan for rate in this race. In fact most of my training was at lower counts and slower rates than the race. Since my plan was to control my pace via SPL, stroke pressure, how much I kicked, etc, then rate would simply result from whatever pace I achieved by doing those things. Since I averaged 17 SPL and a tiny fraction over 21 sec/25, my tempo ended up being pretty close to 1.0.

Pacing: even, negative splits? Definitely negative. Probably a bit more negative than I would aim for in ideal conditions, but under the circumstances my priority was to maintain a feeling of ease and sustainability until pretty late, then bring it home with whatever I had left in the tank
To give you an idea of pace
1st 500: 7:08 Last 500: (1150-1650) 6:54
1st 1000: 14:10 Last 1000: (650-1650) 13:55 -- about a second faster than I swam for my last 1000 race on Jan 23. Which I thought was a fantastic race.

What was your breathing pattern?
Every cycle to the left the entire race--plus an extra breath before turns on laps with even-numbered SPL. I.E. I breathed left, then immediately to the right, as I went into turns when SPL was 16 and 18. Couldn't do that at 17 SPL since final stroke was left.

Turns: did you turn better than usually?
Better than in all past races. As well as I had in practice during which I really focused on them.
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May your laps be as happy as mine.

My TI Story
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  #29  
Old 03-31-2016
terry terry is offline
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Default Distance Ladder--Maintain SPL and Even or Better Pace

Wed 30 March 1700y at SUNY New Paltz

I had only 30 minutes for this practice, due to delays in getting to the pool prior to end of open swim at 1:45 pm. Also I was sore from lifting weights the night before and feeling a bit under the weather. So I decided to do a simple, fairly relaxed pacing problem.
Here's the problem: Increase Distance. Maintain constant SPL. Keep pace even. In the end I actually improved my pace a bit as distance increased.

Tuneup 300 Perfect
I usually swim tuneups at 14 SPL, but my count rose to 15 on the 2nd lap, and I was finding it difficult to maintain--losing momentum into turns and having to delay my flip slightly. So I decided to go with the flow and do today's practice at 16 SPL

Main Task Swim 100-200-300-400 at 16 SPL. Try to keep pace even.
Here are my times
100 - 1:30
200 - 3:02 - my pace slowed slightly from 1:30 to 1:31/100. This is still excellent pace maintenance. Not many people can do this. Even fewer while keeping stroke count constant.
300 - 3:03 - My pace remained the same - still at 1:31/100. Very pleased.
400 - 5:56. Fastest pace yet - 1:29/100.

After finishing this it was still only 1:39. Six minutes to go before pool closed. Time enough to swim another 400. And I thought I could improve pace still more.
Final 400 - 5:49 -- Pace of 1:27/100 and still at 16SPL.
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Terry Laughlin
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May your laps be as happy as mine.

My TI Story
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  #30  
Old 04-05-2016
larsvanzanten
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larsvanzanten View Post
Wow, that's so cool!! I must find a way to get myself taped in a pool (the local pool doesn't allow it) so it might take a few weeks before I can post a video. Is that okay?
Hi Terry,
I (finally) posted my video on the forum! I'm really looking forward to your feedback on it. Thanks already!
http://www.totalimmersion.net/forum/...ead.php?t=8632
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