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  #1  
Old 01-13-2015
szero szero is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2015
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szero
Default Help! Scissor kick & a further hundred things

Hi there,
this is my first post in this forum. I've been swimming for a while and after reading the TI book a few months ago I'm trying to change my style to TI (given that I ever had one...).
I've got a good feeling and feel quite comfortable while swimming, but obviously I've got a severe scissor kicking problem, which I can't get rid of and personally do not notice while swimming.
Well, at least the scissor kick is what I'm seeing - dunno what else is wrong... Is it too much rotation, is it overcrossing while pulling,...???
So I would really appreciate if you could give me some tips on how to improve my style!
http://youtu.be/9LkdG-ulwv0

Thanks in advance,
ro
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  #2  
Old 01-13-2015
borate borate is offline
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Nice flat body positioning; kick timing looks good.

Suggest that you enter slightly wider - don't cross over - and tone down the upper body roll a bit, to avoid twisting. Try breathing through the side of the mouth, Popeye style, instead of turning the head so sharply.

As you recover, envision a path that's nearly straight - from near the hip to approximately shoulder width. As you gently pierce the water, let the fingers droop slightly, by not tensing the hand. Strive for minimum disturbance/bubbles.
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  #3  
Old 01-14-2015
tomoy tomoy is offline
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Greetings Szero - and Welcome!

You pretty much self-diagnosed your primary issues. Kick, over rotation, crossing over. Good self-coaching. I think the crossing over is actually causing everything.

For the kick, touch your feet together and don't let them separate. I put one inside the arch of the other because it's hard to touch toes. Right. Don't kick. Since you don't notice what they're doing while swimming, it's a great way to get a feel for how much they actually move, get in touch with where your feet are. Do this for alternate lengths as a practice between whole stroke sessions. Every now and then while swimming, tuck your head down to look at your feet under water. Because it's fun!

Overall: spear wide, and think about "wide tracks." It looks like you're streamlined in the water, but maybe you're trying to pierce the water right down the middle. That sets you up for over-rotation and that leads to needing to scissor-kick to compensate. Instead, just try to pierce the water for one side of your body at a time, clear water for your shoulder and hip. Then on the other side, just worry about creating that one line down the other side. You'll hear the term "wide tracks" a lot. How wide are your shoulders? 16-18-20 inches? So you want to spear 8-9-10" wide of the center line. That should bring down the rotation, and with less rotation you'll scissor less.

Wide tracks! Good video work too, BTW.
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  #4  
Old 01-14-2015
danm danm is offline
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I'm not sure that the kick timing is right. If you kick when you are rotated your legs will cross, there's no other way. You should kick when you're flat, then rotate. For that, try and sync your kick with the pull on the same side. Now your kick comes a little too early; try to kick when your forearm is vertical, not before. The most frequent advice you hear about kick timing is to kick when the opposite hand enters, which is correct, but that may not help - try to time the kick by the same hand pull. Incidentally this should be pretty much the same as the opposite hand entering, but it may be easier to coordinate if you think about it in these terms.

You're also crossing over, more so with your left hand, but also with the right. I'm not so sure you're over-rotating, but you are taking your elbow to far back during the recovery, I think that maybe that makes it look like over-rotation. The elbow should not go behind the shoulder blades. Imagine your back is at the wall, raise your arm; the wall doesn't let you move the elbow behind the wall. Don't cross that imaginary wall with your elbow when you recover. This is why you rotate, so the arm can recover without straining the shoulder. Don't you have shoulder pain? I think that kind of movement also leads to crossing over - it's all related.

That's what works for me, all I'm saying is give it a try, it may or it may not work for you.
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  #5  
Old 01-14-2015
szero szero is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2015
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szero
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Hi again.

Thank you for your analysis and tips, I really appreciate them.
So next time in water I will try to do wide tracks (also with my elbow? - I always tried to bend my elbow as much as possible and yes, I have shoulder pain mow and then), to do my kick a bit later and try to get my hands out of under my body. Quite a lot things to concentrate at once :)
I'll give you feedback after my next session if you don't mind.
Thanks again,
ro
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  #6  
Old 01-14-2015
mjm mjm is offline
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Default Deep Head

RO: as you spear deeply with your left hand your head follows to about 4-6 inches below the water surface. That makes catching a breath difficult. So you rotate your torso 90 degrees to get your mouth to the surface for air. That 90 degree rotation causes a balance problem so you scissor kick for stability.

Try a shallower spear, keep your head stable and near the surface to facilitate breathing. You should then be able to rotate only 45 degrees or so. Less work, more air. Good luck. Mike
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  #7  
Old 01-14-2015
szero szero is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2015
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szero
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Hi Mike,
thank you for your answer. That's exactly what I thought after watching the video a hundreth time: that I'm diving too deep. And guess what: I really had to concentrate on breathing after adapting to spear deep and now I spear shallower with my right hand - but it seems that it's still too deep (especially my ledt hand).
That swimming stuff is always one step forward two steps back - in fact it's bloody painful.
ro
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