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-   -   Stroke count (http://www.totalimmersion.net/forum/showthread.php?t=729)

jacoby 08-25-2009 05:28 PM

Stroke count
 
I know Stroke count is very important measure for Freestyle but what about on backstroke?

If it is important--What is a good goal?

My backstroke SC is at 23-24 (that is without doing an underwater dolphin)

On the T1 backstroke video it does not say much on BS turns and under water dolphin; Do TI instructors recommend doing an underwater dolphin with a flip turn to increase speed and lessen stroke counts on 100 and 200 yd sets??

If so, how many dolphin kicks?

THANKS to all who contribute to this GREAT "Forum"!!!!

vol 08-27-2009 05:09 AM

Too bad no replies. I'm also interested in this topic. It seems hard to improve the stroke count for backstroke. Some people can kick many times within one hand stroke, so their stroke counts can be quite low (and they look so easy...). I guess there's no way to glide a long distance in one stroke as one does in freestyle? If so, perhaps the only key is to kick more times?

shuumai 08-27-2009 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacoby (Post 5443)
I know Stroke count is very important measure for Freestyle but what about on backstroke?

If it is important--What is a good goal?

My backstroke SC is at 23-24 (that is without doing an underwater dolphin)

On the T1 backstroke video it does not say much on BS turns and under water dolphin; Do TI instructors recommend doing an underwater dolphin with a flip turn to increase speed and lessen stroke counts on 100 and 200 yd sets??

If so, how many dolphin kicks?

THANKS to all who contribute to this GREAT "Forum"!!!!

I don't think TI concerns itself with reducing stroke count by taking advantage of the wall or other pre-stroke techniques. Stroke count is used to measure efficiency from the point at which you take the first stroke.

If you can, stay under for up to 15m. Dolphin away. Just do it consistently so you can compare stroke counts between sets. Make small changes to the stroke and compare the results.

I'm far from good, but what I've been focusing on is not creating drag with my feet. Watch Irie with his pulsing kick. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NotwR_Ex5s

gooner 08-27-2009 06:38 AM

In the book Extraordinary Swimming (which is excellent for backstroke) Terry mentions that SPL should be on a par with freestyle. Mine is nowhere near.

madvet 08-27-2009 02:37 PM

You can CERTAINLY glide -- the same way as in freestyle when your arm is extended.
The glide is a natural rest point to relax the arm- extending muscles.

My SPL is about 14 with a 6-beat kick.

terry 08-27-2009 04:21 PM

I can come close to the same SPL range I use for freestyle when swimming backstroke, but must swim with a VERY low SR to do so. Which is natural since my freestyle repeats are 5 to 8 seconds faster per 50.

I find that the more significant difference between my freestyle and backstroke is Stroke Rate. I was very surprised the first time I used a Tempo Trainer in backstroke to find out how low my SR was. Therefore I wouldn't suggest trying to match your freestyle SPL. Instead find a reasonably efficient SPL for backstroke -- perhaps 2 to 4 added strokes in 25yd/m -- then work with the Tempo Trainer, in the same way as freestyle, to hold a particular stroke count while incrementally increasing tempo.

elskbrev 09-08-2009 01:30 AM

backstroke glide
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by shuumai (Post 5515)
Watch Irie with his pulsing kick. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NotwR_Ex5s

Did anyone notice the pause and glide in Irie's kick? Break it down in three parts. Left side, on back, right side. His kicks while on his sides while he is pulling are much wider than the ones while he is on his back with his lead arm straight out over his head. That's his streamline, pause and glide. So there you have it. Like Madvet said. :o)
Cindy

vol 09-08-2009 02:09 AM

But his hips seem to sink?? The body is not straight, but like a "V"? Shouldn't one have high hips?

CoachBobM 01-25-2010 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vol (Post 5743)
But his hips seem to sink?? The body is not straight, but like a "V"? Shouldn't one have high hips?

I agree. If his hips were higher, I think he'd experience significantly less drag.


Bob


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